Governor book 3

So I've read that the working title for book three has been tentatively assigned as Dictator.

This strikes me as forboding as this is the telling of the rise of Emperor Terrance Murphy. The first two books seem like a reasonable progression in the rise of a new emperor, Governor, Rebel. But to apparently head in the direction of a dictator after those two positive titles?

I can't wait to find out where they're going, but it sounds as if it WON'T be only a trilogy.

Mycall4me wrote:So I've read that the working title for book three has been tentatively assigned as Dictator.

This strikes me as forboding as this is the telling of the rise of Emperor Terrance Murphy. The first two books seem like a reasonable progression in the rise of a new emperor, Governor, Rebel. But to apparently head in the direction of a dictator after those two positive titles?

Um, think about it a bit more.

From In Fury Born, Chapter 2:
Those sixty years of vicious, deadly warfare had turned the Federation into the Terran Empire, under Emperor Terrence I of the House of Murphy. They had also led to the League's utter military and economic exhaustion . . . at which point its Rishathan "friends and neighbors" had launched the First Human-Rish War with a devastating assault into its rear areas. Their victim had been taken totally by surprise, and in barely eight years, the Sphere had conquered virtually the entire League.
Unfortunately for the Rish, whose plans had succeeded up to that point with a perfection which would have turned Machiavelli green with envy, the Terran Empire had proved a much tougher proposition. Especially because the time the Sphere was forced to spend digesting its territorial conquests in the League following HRW-I gave Terrence I time to put his own house in order and reorganize, rebuild, and expand his navy.
The Second Human-Rish War had lasted fourteen years, not eight. And despite its war weariness and the political chaos which the six decades of the League Wars had produced, the Empire had been solidly united behind its charismatic new Emperor. Besides, by that time humanity had figured out who was really responsible for those sixty horrendous years of death and destruction. By the end of HRW-II, the Empire had taken two-thirds of the old League's star systems away from the Rish and driven the Sphere to the brink of total military defeat. Under the Treaty of Leviathan, which had formally ended the war, the Rishathan Sphere had been required to return to its pre-HRW-I borders, and the remaining third of the old League which had not already been incorporated into the Empire had found itself at least nominally independent-the so-called "Rogue Worlds" which served as a buffer zone between the two interstellar great powers and belonged to neither.


He's rebelling against a "Federation" that has only elected officials.

He's ending up with "the Head of State is me, and in the future will be one of my heirs."

Exactly how do you think that transition takes place, without going through the "dictator" phase?

The Rish will very shortly be attacking humanity, starting with the League. At which point the credibility of the Federation Gov't, which has been peddling the "The Rish are totally peaceful, totally over that whole war-like phase" BS is going to fall to nothing with everyone. So you have:

1: Federation Gov't has lost its legitimacy
2: League gov't is in collapse (their push against the Feds utterly failed because of Murphy, and the Rish are attacking them and kicking their butts, because the Rish through their "aid" to the League have near total knowledge of where the League's military is, and what's in each location, enabling them to either launch attacks in overwhelming force, or else just skip places where they can't win easily)
3: Murphy is winning his side of the Civil War

You really think he's going to swan in, and then let the Heart Worlds / The 500 continue to dominate? No? Then there goes democracy
You really think he's just going to announce "The Federation is at an end, and I'm replacing it with my hereditary rule"?

Not going to happen.

He's going to establish a dictatorship. He's going to give the Heart Worlds a taste of what they've been doing to the Fringe. he's going to spend decades, IIRC, fighting the Rish.

And, when he's beaten the Rish, brought an end to the war with the League, and demonstrated good governance, then, and only then, will there be discussion about making this "one man rule" thing more permanent with a hereditary monarchy

Mycall4me wrote:So I've read that the working title for book three has been tentatively assigned as Dictator.

This strikes me as forboding as this is the telling of the rise of Emperor Terrance Murphy. The first two books seem like a reasonable progression in the rise of a new emperor, Governor, Rebel. But to apparently head in the direction of a dictator after those two positive titles?

Tl;dr:

Until The 500 and their power is broken, Murphy won't be restoring democracy to the Federation.

So yes, "dictator"

One man: Cincinattus, whom Geo. Washington and the entire first generation of (US) Founders, modeled themselves on.

Fox2! wrote:One man: Cincinattus, whom Geo. Washington and the entire first generation of (US) Founders, modeled themselves on.

Cincinattus and Geo. Washington both worked for systems that weren't utterly corrupt.

Murphy doesn't have that joy

GregD wrote:

Fox2! wrote:One man: Cincinattus, whom Geo. Washington and the entire first generation of (US) Founders, modeled themselves on.

Cincinattus and Geo. Washington both worked for systems that weren't utterly corrupt.

Murphy doesn't have that joy

.

True. Which is why Terrence (First of his Name, and of his House) won't be returning to his plow (Survey Command) after he overthrows the Five Hundred and the Federation, and defeats the League.

Fox2! wrote:

GregD wrote:
Cincinattus and Geo. Washington both worked for systems that weren't utterly corrupt.

Murphy doesn't have that joy

.

True. Which is why Terrence (First of his Name, and of his House) won't be returning to his plow (Survey Command) after he overthrows the Five Hundred and the Federation, and defeats the League.

I've been rereading the first two books, and I think we'll see two people who could be called dictators in Book 3.

Murphy will take the Cincinnatus role, or be drafted into it, for the Free Worlds Alliance. But I expect to see (trying to avoid spoilers here) a certain obese member of the Five Hundred decide that if you want something done right you've got to do it yourself, and come out into the open with just how much the Five Hundred controls the Fed government. And since his power is extralegal in the first place, "dictator" would be a reasonable description of his regime.

Julia Minor wrote:
(SNIP!)

I've been rereading the first two books, and I think we'll see two people who could be called dictators in Book 3.

Murphy will take the Cincinnatus role, or be drafted into it, for the Free Worlds Alliance. But I expect to see (trying to avoid spoilers here) a certain obese member of the Five Hundred decide that if you want something done right you've got to do it yourself, and come out into the open with just how much the Five Hundred controls the Fed government. And since his power is extralegal in the first place, "dictator" would be a reasonable description of his regime.

I don't there will be enough time for secret Master of the Federation to realize how badly things have gone wrong (and thus need his personal intervention) before Murphy comes calling. Besides, the titles of the first 2 titles (and the projected title of the 4th, _Emperor_) refer to Murphy and I expect the 3rd to be the same.

Actually wondering if the title references the original meaning of the word.

In the Roman Republic there was an official position of Dictator - in times of extreme external (military) threat to the Republic the Senate could, and did, appoint one individual as Dictator for the duration of the crisis with complete military power to deal with it.

So maybe something like the Rish showing their hand and a large-scale revolt of not only the Fringe but also elements of the Heart’s citizenry will force the failing government to appoint their own Dictator. Of course, as is par for the course throughout history, Dictators are rarely lauded or honoured once they’ve ended the threat…..

ArchidamusofTW wrote:Actually wondering if the title references the original meaning of the word.

In the Roman Republic there was an official position of Dictator - in times of extreme external (military) threat to the Republic the Senate could, and did, appoint one individual as Dictator for the duration of the crisis with complete military power to deal with it.

So maybe something like the Rish showing their hand and a large-scale revolt of not only the Fringe but also elements of the Heart’s citizenry will force the failing government to appoint their own Dictator. Of course, as is par for the course throughout history, Dictators are rarely lauded or honoured once they’ve ended the threat…..

I think it is unlikely (because of communication lag). BTW, for some reason, I had thought that the title of the 3rd book would be _Tyrant_, which I was using in its original meaning (i.e., somebody who took power outside legitimate channels).