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Guns, Guns Guns

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Re: Guns, Guns Guns
Post by Michael Everett   » Mon Apr 26, 2021 6:21 am

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Just as a note, an American Talk-show host very recently said that the cop who shot a black girl (who was trying to stab another girl at the time) should have fired a warning shot into the air first.

I've never fired anything more than a bow or water pistol, but even I can see the major problem with warning shots fired into the air. The bullet will come down again at close to the same speed as it went up, plus it will be tumbling, not spinning.
There are many records worldwide of people being hit by bullets dropping from the sky due to some idiot firing into the air (usually in celebration of something) and mortal injuries are known to happen.

...As Americans have a thing about guns, should they not be taught about gun safety and the reasons for it while still at school?
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Re: Guns, Guns Guns
Post by Annachie   » Mon Apr 26, 2021 7:01 am

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Imaginos1892 wrote:Riiiiight. All the guards 'just happened' to be not paying attention at the same time the security cameras had 'technical problems' AND Epstein decided to 'commit suicide' just then, instead of half an hour earlier or later.

That's at least one coincidence too many.
———————————
I used to live on a farm. I know what bullshit smells like.


That I agree with.

At best it was assisted suicide.
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Re: Guns, Guns Guns
Post by Annachie   » Mon Apr 26, 2021 7:04 am

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Personally, warning shots are a no no.

If there's time for a warning shot then you probably didn't need to have the gun out.
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You are so going to die. :p ~~~~ runsforcelery
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
still not dead. :)
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Re: Guns, Guns Guns
Post by Daryl   » Mon Apr 26, 2021 7:20 am

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Years ago I was travelling for work a lot, and my wife asked a cop friend about her using a gun for self defence.
Things have tightened up a lot in the decades since, and we have to have our guns so locked up that you couldn't use them for home self defence.
However at the time I thought his advice was amusing. He said that no jury would convict a woman alone in her house who shot an intruder, particularly if she fired a warning shot into the ceiling first. He then followed up with the advice that no forensics team could determine if the warning shot was fired before or after the lethal one.


Annachie wrote:Personally, warning shots are a no no.

If there's time for a warning shot then you probably didn't need to have the gun out.
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Re: Guns, Guns Guns
Post by Joat42   » Mon Apr 26, 2021 10:56 am

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Michael Everett wrote:The bullet will come down again at close to the same speed as it went up, plus it will be tumbling, not spinning.

No, it wont have the same speed since it will reach terminal velocity on the way down, ie ~65 m/s as compared to a muzzle velocity of >300 m/s for modern guns. Getting hit by a tumbling bullet traveling at ~65 m/s may give you a bruise or poke your eye out, but it will definitely not kill you.

And I have to wonder, who in their right mind fires a warning shot in to the air? It's better to aim down, since hitting the ground will dissipate most of the energy the bullet has so it's rendered harmless faster.

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Re: Guns, Guns Guns
Post by Michael Everett   » Mon Apr 26, 2021 12:52 pm

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Joat42 wrote:Getting hit by a tumbling bullet traveling at ~65 m/s may give you a bruise or poke your eye out, but it will definitely not kill you.

July 22, 2003: More than 20 people were killed in Iraq from celebratory gunfire following the deaths of Saddam Hussein's sons Uday and Qusay in 2003.
January 1, 2005: A stray bullet hit a young girl during New Year celebrations in the central square of downtown Skopje, North Macedonia. She died two days later.
February 25, 2007: Five people were killed by stray bullets fired at a kite festival in Lahore, Pakistan, including a six-year-old schoolboy who was struck in the head near his home in the city's Mazang area.
July 29, 2007: At least four people were killed and 17 others wounded by celebratory gunfire in the capital city of Baghdad, Iraq, following the victory of the national football team in the AFC Asian Cup.
January 1, 2010: A four-year-old boy, Marquel Peters, was struck by a bullet and killed inside his church The Church of God of Prophecy in Decatur, GA.
August 2010: 2 people were killed and 13 were injured in Jordan, as part of the yearly celebration of the announcement of the result of Tawjihi.
November 21, 2012: Following a cease-fire ending fighting with Israel, celebratory gunfire in the Gaza Strip killed a man and wounded three others.
April 6, 2014: A 20-year-old pregnant mother of two, Wadia Baidawi, was struck in the head and killed by a stray bullet from her neighbor’s wedding in Sidon, Lebanon

Wikipedia wrote:Bullets fired into the air usually fall back with terminal velocities much lower than their muzzle velocity when they leave the barrel of a firearm. Nevertheless, people can be injured, sometimes fatally, when bullets discharged into the air fall back down to the ground. Bullets fired at angles less than vertical are more dangerous as the projectile maintains its angular ballistic trajectory and is far less likely to engage in tumbling motion; it therefore travels at speeds much higher than a bullet in free fall.


I will admit I was wrong about the tumbling part.

The source I used is Wikipedia, notably the page on Celebratory Gunfire.
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I can't write anywhere near as well as Weber
But I try nonetheless, And even do my own artwork.

(Now on Twitter)and mentioned by RFC!
ACNH Dreams at DA-6594-0940-7995
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Re: Guns, Guns Guns
Post by Joat42   » Mon Apr 26, 2021 7:56 pm

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Michael Everett wrote:
Wikipedia wrote:Bullets fired into the air usually fall back with terminal velocities much lower than their muzzle velocity when they leave the barrel of a firearm. Nevertheless, people can be injured, sometimes fatally, when bullets discharged into the air fall back down to the ground. Bullets fired at angles less than vertical are more dangerous as the projectile maintains its angular ballistic trajectory and is far less likely to engage in tumbling motion; it therefore travels at speeds much higher than a bullet in free fall.


I will admit I was wrong about the tumbling part.

The source I used is Wikipedia, notably the page on Celebratory Gunfire.

Unless you actually check the citations, you don't know exactly under which circumstances they where killed. Where they hit because they stood in the trajectory of the bullet or where they hit by a falling bullet that was fired vertically.

The point was firing vertically into the air. Firing off the vertical means you are trading height for lateral motion, for angles near vertical the lateral motion is so small that the imparted energy on a hit from it is non-lethal. There are numerous videos of "celebratory firing" and most of them are seldom vertical.

---
Jack of all trades and destructive tinkerer.


Anyone who have simple solutions for complex problems is a fool.
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Re: Guns, Guns Guns
Post by n7axw   » Sun May 02, 2021 9:22 pm

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Humm...it would still be a good thing to remember that a bullet that goes up must come down... I've always wondered about the working brainpower of someone who would fire a gun randomly in any direction... including up.

Don

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Re: Guns, Guns Guns
Post by n7axw   » Sun May 02, 2021 9:23 pm

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Humm...it would still be a good thing to remember that a bullet that goes up must come down... I've always wondered about the working brainpower of someone who would fire a gun randomly in any direction... including up.

Don

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When any group seeks political power in God's name, both religion and politics are instantly corrupted.
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Re: Guns, Guns Guns
Post by cthia   » Mon May 03, 2021 1:59 am

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No selfish idiot who is going to fire a gun in the air is going to fire a gun downwards, and take a chance of being killed by a ricocheting bullet.

Also, the age of the victim has a lot to do with whether a bullet in free fall can kill. The density of skin and bones vary a lot with age.

At any rate, you cannot assume that the unwitting victim of a stray bullet in free fall is stationary. The added kph could certainly be deadly.

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
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