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Metric system of measurements

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Re: Metric system of measurements
Post by Daryl   » Sat Jul 03, 2021 1:00 am

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jtg452 wrote:
Our foreign friend thinks that we need a STRONG (his emphasis, not mine) central government to shove such a change down our collective throats- so we can be made to conform- in more ways than merely using a different system of measure.


Not sure if I'm the foreign friend, not that it matters. If so I should point out that in the past decade we had 5 PMs within 4 years. We do control our politicians, but at the same time our system is much more federal than the US. So not under the thumb at all, but also not at the whim of separate ununited states.
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Re: Metric system of measurements
Post by jtg452   » Sat Jul 03, 2021 6:00 pm

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Joat42 wrote:... when it comes actual engineering and science where exactness is often the thing that decides if something works or not. There's a reason why historically when doing precision-engineering in imperial, you tried to stick to just one type of unit throughout, since conversion between some units introduced precision-losses.

Adherence to the mantra of "this is what I was taught, I can't be bothered to learn something else" is a sign of stagnation or just plain stubbornness in the face of progress.


Yeah, the Russians' use of the metric system is why they beat the US to the Moon, right? :roll:

(I only mention it because the space program was a great example of both engineering and science.)

Sorry, I just don't buy into the claim that metric is any better. It scales up and down easier because of its' using a base 10.

In Safehold's case, just having a standardized unit of measure was revolutionary.
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Re: Metric system of measurements
Post by Daryl   » Sat Jul 03, 2021 8:56 pm

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I wonder if the same arguments were used against the Arabic system of numbers and in defence of the Roman system?
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Re: Metric system of measurements
Post by jtg452   » Sun Jul 04, 2021 12:27 pm

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Daryl wrote:I wonder if the same arguments were used against the Arabic system of numbers and in defence of the Roman system?

Ha! Ha!

Odd that you mention Roman numerals since that was the first change Merlin made on Safehold, remember?

You still haven't come up with why the metric system is as superior as you seem to believe. I haven't claimed that it is inferior to Imperial- just different- so changing for changing's sake is more about a need for conformity than actual improvement or necessity.
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Re: Metric system of measurements
Post by Undercover Fat Kid   » Tue Jul 06, 2021 10:08 pm

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Metric is the better system because everyone uses it, including America, if we were only adult enough to admit it. America’s metrication is a fait accompli. The war is over, SAE lost. Just like with our right to a trial by jury or our right to privacy, we beat our chests about it, but it’s already over. The only people who get a jury trial are the ones who can afford an entire team of attorneys and the ones who are going to die penniless & in jail. Big tech collects every scrap of information about you and hands it over on demand to the feds, often without a warrant and generally without telling you. The SAE system of measurements are defined solely by their relationship to their metric counterparts. Professionals like me end up spending millions of dollars on niche tools that are useless outside of very specific applications while the rest of the world scoffs at us and enjoys all of the benefits that come from having a thorough, thoughtfully laid out, consistent and repeatable system of measurements.

From the link: “….in fact all U.S. customary units are based on the International System of Units….”

https://www.nist.gov/pml/us-surveyfoot/ ... tions-faqs

jtg452 wrote:
Daryl wrote:I wonder if the same arguments were used against the Arabic system of numbers and in defence of the Roman system?

Ha! Ha!

Odd that you mention Roman numerals since that was the first change Merlin made on Safehold, remember?

You still haven't come up with why the metric system is as superior as you seem to believe. I haven't claimed that it is inferior to Imperial- just different- so changing for changing's sake is more about a need for conformity than actual improvement or necessity.
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Re: Metric system of measurements
Post by Joat42   » Wed Jul 07, 2021 3:02 pm

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jtg452 wrote:Yeah, the Russians' use of the metric system is why they beat the US to the Moon, right? :roll:

And the use of imperial is why the Challenger is still around.. :roll:

---
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Re: Metric system of measurements
Post by Joat42   » Wed Jul 07, 2021 3:11 pm

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jtg452 wrote:You still haven't come up with why the metric system is as superior as you seem to believe. I haven't claimed that it is inferior to Imperial- just different- so changing for changing's sake is more about a need for conformity than actual improvement or necessity.

The whole metric system is based on 7 constants, the imperial is based on 20+ and have inherent inaccuracies in conversion between units. For everyday use this isn't a problem, but as soon you get into science and engineering, problems arise.

---
Jack of all trades and destructive tinkerer.


Anyone who have simple solutions for complex problems is a fool.
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Re: Metric system of measurements
Post by jtg452   » Thu Jul 08, 2021 9:59 am

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Joat42 wrote:And the use of imperial is why the Challenger is still around.. :roll:

Actually, that would be NASA's hubris. Relying on gaskets to seal fuel cells and then launching at a temperature well below the safety limit of those gaskets is what led to the explosion. Who knew that gaskets shrank in cold temperatures? (Other than anyone with any practical experience with gaskets, of course.)

Besides, Challenger was built after the metric boondoogle- and, as you and others have pointed out, the metric system was adopted by the science and engineering communities long ago.

I wonder if the Russians bothered to convert to metric when they put their clone of the B-29 (the TU-4) into production.
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Re: Metric system of measurements
Post by Joat42   » Thu Jul 08, 2021 11:26 am

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jtg452 wrote:
Joat42 wrote:And the use of imperial is why the Challenger is still around.. :roll:

Actually, that would be NASA's hubris. Relying on gaskets to seal fuel cells and then launching at a temperature well below the safety limit of those gaskets is what led to the explosion. Who knew that gaskets shrank in cold temperatures? (Other than anyone with any practical experience with gaskets, of course.)

So it was unrelated to what measurement-system being used then. But you think the Russians failed being the first to land on the moon because they used metric? It couldn't be something like, I don't know - the rivalry between the engineers, insufficient budget and a lack of technical expertise?

---
Jack of all trades and destructive tinkerer.


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Re: Metric system of measurements
Post by jtg452   » Fri Jul 09, 2021 9:10 am

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Joat42 wrote:So it was unrelated to what measurement-system being used then. But you think the Russians failed being the first to land on the moon because they used metric? It couldn't be something like, I don't know - the rivalry between the engineers, insufficient budget and a lack of technical expertise?

No, it's called sarcasm.

One of the arguments presented was that the metric system is superior because it's used in engineering and science.

I sarcastically pointed out that one of the (if not the single) greatest scientific and engineering feats of modern times- putting man on the moon- was done using equipment made using Imperial measurements and that sort of flies in the face of their assertion.

Come to think of it, so would Chuck Yeager's breaking the sound barrier in level flight.

And Wilbur and Orville's flights at Kittyhawk.

The Soviets didn't make it to the moon for a plethora of reasons completely unrelated to something as silly as what unit of measure they used when building their equipment.

Again-

I don't buy into the claim that Imperial is inadequate. I also think that the claims of metric's superiority are vastly overstated.
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