Jonathan_S wrote:I agree that it's likely one or the other.
Though I think the low speed of their torpedoes is less of an issue in an ambush scenario - and their strengths seem to lie in ambush scenarios.
Yes even many freighters have more acceleration than a graser torp. But what the torp does have is lots of endurance. And most ships move on reasonably predictable courses - whether it's a warship on in-system patrol, someone headed to/from a wormhole terminus, or ships traveling between the hyper limit and an inhabited planet, or simply hanging around in orbit. Ships, even warships, aren't usually making high acceleration movements between entirely unguessable points in space.
Ambushes are great for the MAlign-that-was. When they were this shadowy organisation no one knew about and had a handful of ships that were trying to wreak anonymous havoc in the Galaxy, ambushes of unsuspecting foes were an acceptable solution.
For the MAN, in a state of declared war against a prepared foe, that's not the case. Freighters will still likely take least-time-course (thus, predictable) paths from hyperlimit to warehouses and back. And in most systems, orbital warehouses can't be protected.
But warships will not do that, at least not more than once. Warships should never take easy, predictable paths anywhere. And big, important systems like Manticore, Haven, Sigma Draconis, Yeltsin's Star and New Berlin, as well as now Earth, will be able to protect their orbits. Once burned, thrice shy, after all.
And besides, ambushes require that the enemy cooperate. LDs and torpedoes can't hit a target that never wanders into the ambush. You can't conduct a war with ambushes and expect to win.
If a spider ship can get into a system undetected it shouldn't have too much trouble staking out an viable ambush spot. A graser torp launched at a ship arriving in system might not catch it until after the ship's made turnover and started slowing down halfway to its destination - but since the torp has that endurance that's not a major problem.
Heck, it would appear that a torp launched from well outside the hyper limit has the endurance to make its way into planetary orbit to strike its target.
Two problems with that. First, as I said above, it's the problem of getting the torpedo into range of a forewarned target that is making evasive course changes as a matter of routine and never taking direct paths. Warships have power to spare, so they can afford not to take the least-time-course. And they'll keep their open aspects randomly jinking, so the torpedo has no choice but to attempt to attack through the sidewall. We don't know how well a 3-second torpedo shot fares against those.
Second, it's the insertion. You started with "if a spider ship can get into a system undetected." That's not a big "if," it's a huge, enormous one! Hyper translations are not stealthy, so any system with a hyper detection net worth its salt will see the translation to multiple light-days out. The big systems in the list above will see them to light-months. So this undetected insertion is a process taking anywhere between multiple days to multiple months. Ships thus inserted either need very reliable, ahead-of-time intel, or they will always be attacking targets of opportunity.
It gets worse: ships can't be in two places at the same time. So a huge 12-million-tonne LD represents a huge investment and commitment of resources to a plan that may or may not work. Remember: the enemy gets a vote and may vote not to be at the ambush site.
So, again, this is good for ambushing unsuspecting foes, but not good to conduct a war. Impeller ships not attempting to be stealthy have much better mobility. They can react much faster to changing circumstances.
And let's not forget the control freaks that may be trying to micromanage a war from Darius, thus further increasing the control loop delays.
Now none of that appears to justify building a ship as enormous as it seems a Lenny Det is. A smaller ship designed around a torp bay would seem to be able to deliver that kind of ambush strike for less money (or in more places for the same money).
But still, I look forward to seeing what use the MAlign tried to make of them, and what their capabilities really are.
I quote agree. It would be much better to build a dozen BC- and BB-sized ships for the cost of one LD. The big issue with that is that spider acceleration is roughly propotional to the length of the ship, so if you make it too small, it won't get to 150 gravities. That means there's a minimum viable size.
One other failing: capital ships never travel in isolation. Ever heard of a superdreadnought making raids? No. Capital ships not only fly in squadron force most of the time, breaking down to division strength only if forced to cover multiple systems, they are always accompanied by screening elements. Even a puny pre-war DN division would have a force of scouting DDs and would be protected by CAs.
Of the MAN, we've only heard of BB- and monitor-sized ships (Shark and LD, respectively) and scouts (the Ghosts). Is the MAN expecting the LDs to fight in penny packets?
Again, huge resource commitment: each lost LD is a major blow for the MAN and its effective fighting force.
With most Sci-Fi authors, I'd expect such glaring flaws in strategy to be hand-waved away ("don't ask inconvenient questions"). With David, I expect him not only to have thought of this before, I expect him to have held back surprises for us.