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Re: ?
Post by cthia   » Sun Oct 10, 2021 3:20 pm

cthia
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ThinksMarkedly wrote:
cthia wrote:Do better? I don't imagine that will be a problem for a navy that is fighting in their own backyard. They can launch far more massive volleys I'm sure. But 20,000 at a pop will do just fine. Remember, the GA's Fleet train has been sent to the bottom of the sea. It is now a war of attrition. The GA can only withstand 20k missile salvos until their payload of CMs hold out. Which won't be long.


BTW, if Darius happens to be heavily seeded with invisible platforms capable of massive graser torp launches they can do so at will. A GA squadron could be headed right smack dab into a graser swarm. Of course they are preoccupied by the 20,000 incoming wedges that they can see.


I'm sure they have orders of magnitude more than 20,000 Cataphracts on stock. The problem is not how many they have, it's how many can get into optimum range. If the blockading fleet is moving in unpredictable directions, you can't get sufficient pods in close proximity except by chance. That means diluting them through space. And this applies to torpedoes too, but it's much more difficult for torpedoes because those can't cover the last 2-light-minutes at will.

Which may be a viable strategy. Presumably, the hosts have far bigger magazines than what the blockaders have on-board. So you can simply wear them out if they have to stay inside the hyperlimit.

As kzt said in one of these Salmon streams, sooner or later the GA is going to display some type of pattern, but, I don't understand, why must the invisible MAN remain inside the hyper limit?

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
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Re: ?
Post by ThinksMarkedly   » Sun Oct 10, 2021 4:25 pm

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cthia wrote:As kzt said in one of these Salmon streams, sooner or later the GA is going to display some type of pattern, but, I don't understand, why must the invisible MAN remain inside the hyper limit?


Volume. Placing them outside the forces you're trying to catch makes approach vectors more difficult, not easier. Makes maintenance easier too, since there's less time to move around those shoals. If you don't have FTL control, then you also have to factor in the time lag to launch orders, though we can now be sure that an attack on Darius, whenever that happens, will face FTL comms (TBD whether it's crude or not, but it will exist).

Though one calculation I made earlier today make argue for your point: room to accelerate. With only 10-light-minutes from the planet-that-must-be-defended to the hyperlimit, at 150 gravities the weapons would only reach 0.25c. You need 27 light-minutes to reach 0.4c, which means they need to accelerate from the other side of the star. The gravitational pull of the star should be negligible, and the little of it there is, would be negative if you're climbing out of the inner system.
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Re: ?
Post by cthia   » Tue Oct 26, 2021 3:22 am

cthia
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I was thinking (I know, it is as dangerous as Black Victor thinking :lol:) but let's revisit the wedge/g-torp hybrid.

If it is possible for such a hybrid to surreptitiously eject the warhead beforehand at optimum range and the rest of the missile continues on to the target, the warhead may be overlooked even more because point defense would be concentrating on the remaining part of the missile while the ejected warhead fires. It won't exactly duplicate the many false images of missiles Apollo does but hey, any amount of deception rings true.

"You mean false."

"True."

The idea sounds ludicrous because the warhead has to be powered to fire and the capacitors will be left in the remaining missile, but what if a segment could be ejected which contains higher capacity much less volume intensive capacitors?

Perhaps the big show down in several centuries the MA will develop such capacitors. Flux capacitors as, someone, suggested?

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
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Re: ?
Post by tlb   » Tue Oct 26, 2021 7:54 am

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cthia wrote:The idea sounds ludicrous because the warhead has to be powered to fire and the capacitors will be left in the remaining missile, but what if a segment could be ejected which contains higher capacity much less volume intensive capacitors?

Perhaps the big show down in several centuries the MA will develop such capacitors. Flux capacitors as, someone, suggested?

If "higher capacity much less volume intensive capacitors" exist, then why would a weapons designer/builder use an older style that was bigger with less power? Isn't it the case that that all the capacitors in a missile will be as small and as high powered as the technology allows.

If you are going to propose detachable warheads, then why stop with just one per missile?
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Re: ?
Post by cthia   » Tue Oct 26, 2021 8:06 am

cthia
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tlb wrote:
cthia wrote:The idea sounds ludicrous because the warhead has to be powered to fire and the capacitors will be left in the remaining missile, but what if a segment could be ejected which contains higher capacity much less volume intensive capacitors?

Perhaps the big show down in several centuries the MA will develop such capacitors. Flux capacitors as, someone, suggested?

If "higher capacity much less volume intensive capacitors" exist, then why would a weapons designer/builder use an older style that was bigger with less power? Isn't it the case that that all the capacitors in a missile will be as small and as high powered as the technology allows.

If you are going to propose detachable warheads, then why stop with just one per missile?

A weapons designer wouldn't. I wasn't clear. All of the capacitors would be these newly developed capacitors. However, if they are so efficient then a cache of them can be ejected with the warhead since they would be unused on the trip to the target and thus are able to be held in reserve.

However, I see a potential problem of the ejected warhead being destroyed by the wedge of the remaining missile if the warhead can't be ejected far enough away, which at first glance seems to be difficult.

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
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Re: ?
Post by cthia   » Sat Nov 20, 2021 6:42 pm

cthia
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The lastest post in the Attacking Darius thread by ThinksMarkedly got me to thinking. And the craziness of it belongs in this thread which has been sort of a marriage between Hemphill, Foraker, Project Gram and Bolthole. I thought I'd keep everything in the proper file.

IINM, hyper generators are volume intensive. But, would it be possible for a specialized ship to be built that has two separate hyper generator systems. So that a warship could translate into a system - fire weapons - and then immediately switch to the already spun up auxillary system and hyper back out? Thus, avoiding the fatal cycle time.

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
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Re: ?
Post by tlb   » Sat Nov 20, 2021 10:20 pm

tlb
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cthia wrote:The lastest post in the Attacking Darius thread by ThinksMarkedly got me to thinking. And the craziness of it belongs in this thread which has been sort of a marriage between Hemphill, Foraker, Project Gram and Bolthole. I thought I'd keep everything in the proper file.

IINM, hyper generators are volume intensive. But, would it be possible for a specialized ship to be built that has two separate hyper generator systems. So that a warship could translate into a system - fire weapons - and then immediately switch to the already spun up auxillary system and hyper back out? Thus, avoiding the fatal cycle time.

Haven't you proposed something like this before? Isn't it forbidden by the word of the author?
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Re: ?
Post by cthia   » Sat Nov 20, 2021 11:23 pm

cthia
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Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2014 1:10 pm

tlb wrote:
cthia wrote:The lastest post in the Attacking Darius thread by ThinksMarkedly got me to thinking. And the craziness of it belongs in this thread which has been sort of a marriage between Hemphill, Foraker, Project Gram and Bolthole. I thought I'd keep everything in the proper file.

IINM, hyper generators are volume intensive. But, would it be possible for a specialized ship to be built that has two separate hyper generator systems. So that a warship could translate into a system - fire weapons - and then immediately switch to the already spun up auxillary system and hyper back out? Thus, avoiding the fatal cycle time.

Haven't you proposed something like this before? Isn't it forbidden by the word of the author?

Not I, lest I forgot. But thanks for the info that it is taboo.

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
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Re: ?
Post by Jonathan_S   » Sun Nov 21, 2021 12:20 am

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tlb wrote:
cthia wrote:The lastest post in the Attacking Darius thread by ThinksMarkedly got me to thinking. And the craziness of it belongs in this thread which has been sort of a marriage between Hemphill, Foraker, Project Gram and Bolthole. I thought I'd keep everything in the proper file.

IINM, hyper generators are volume intensive. But, would it be possible for a specialized ship to be built that has two separate hyper generator systems. So that a warship could translate into a system - fire weapons - and then immediately switch to the already spun up auxillary system and hyper back out? Thus, avoiding the fatal cycle time.

Haven't you proposed something like this before? Isn't it forbidden by the word of the author?


Seems to have aged off the forum - but I've got this from an RFC post from 12-Jun-2012 in the thread 'SPOILER – finding the torch wormhole’s destination' (And I didn't happen to note who he was responding to)
runsforcelery wrote:However, this is where the problem of "nested" hyper generators comes in, because you cannot have a hyper generator online inside another hyper generator's translation field. That means you can't even have it at Routine Readiness. The inner hyper generator would have to be at Powered Down status

There are few other spots where he mentions it not being practical/useful (once saying "for multiple reasons") to mount multiple hyper generators but this seems to be the one with the most explanation.

So even if you mounted a second hyper generator (and there may be reasons he didn't go into in this post what that's still not doable) it couldn't save you any time. (Though technically we've see powered down hyper generators placed within another hyper generator's field - for example when the Torch Frigates caught a ride on the Hali Sowle. But that was just to sneak in without extra hyper footprints -- so it wouldn't matter if the frigates had to fully power down their hyper generators. They weren't planning a quick hyper out anyway)

IIRC there are also ship transport ships, able to bring a crippled ship to a yard; and that would be another example of hyper generator within another field; but again one where it doesn't matter that one hyper generator is fully powered down.
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Re: ?
Post by cthia   » Sun Nov 21, 2021 12:35 am

cthia
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Posts: 13794
Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2014 1:10 pm

tlb wrote:
cthia wrote:The lastest post in the Attacking Darius thread by ThinksMarkedly got me to thinking. And the craziness of it belongs in this thread which has been sort of a marriage between Hemphill, Foraker, Project Gram and Bolthole. I thought I'd keep everything in the proper file.

IINM, hyper generators are volume intensive. But, would it be possible for a specialized ship to be built that has two separate hyper generator systems. So that a warship could translate into a system - fire weapons - and then immediately switch to the already spun up auxillary system and hyper back out? Thus, avoiding the fatal cycle time.

Haven't you proposed something like this before? Isn't it forbidden by the word of the author?


Jonathan_S wrote:Seems to have aged off the forum - but I've got this from an RFC post from 12-Jun-2012 in the thread 'SPOILER – finding the torch wormhole’s destination' (And I didn't happen to note who he was responding to)
runsforcelery wrote:However, this is where the problem of "nested" hyper generators comes in, because you cannot have a hyper generator online inside another hyper generator's translation field. That means you can't even have it at Routine Readiness. The inner hyper generator would have to be at Powered Down status

There are few other spots where he mentions it not being practical/useful (once saying "for multiple reasons") to mount multiple hyper generators but this seems to be the one with the most explanation.

So even if you mounted a second hyper generator (and there may be reasons he didn't go into in this post what that's still not doable) it couldn't save you any time. (Though technically we've see powered down hyper generators placed within another hyper generator's field - for example when the Torch Frigates caught a ride on the Hali Sowle. But that was just to sneak in without extra hyper footprints -- so it wouldn't matter if the frigates had to fully power down their hyper generators. They weren't planning a quick hyper out anyway)

IIRC there are also ship transport ships, able to bring a crippled ship to a yard; and that would be another example of hyper generator within another field; but again one where it doesn't matter that one hyper generator is fully powered down.

Thanks. I didn't join the forum until 2014. Albeit, I still could have mentioned it as well. Like minds think alike.

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
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