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OK KZT: What's wrong with AAC?

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Re: OK KZT: What's wrong with AAC?
Post by Loren Pechtel   » Tue May 10, 2022 12:14 am

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cthia wrote:But I am asking how, exactly is that accomplished? Do the missiles incorporate some sort of highly sensitive gimbal that interfaces with the computer which measures time and acceleration to figure position?


Even in our time laser gyroscopes have replaced gimbals when you need a good answer.
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Re: OK KZT: What's wrong with AAC?
Post by Loren Pechtel   » Tue May 10, 2022 1:11 am

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cthia wrote:But! What makes Apollo so special that the missiles DO NOT NEED THE LINK?! So an Apollo missile can just arrange itself toward the right "quadrant of the sky" before it lights off its drive, and it won't light off before its cohort in front of it lights off? And it will head towards the enemy all without additional instructions after it leaves the ship? So, Apollo missiles no longer need an FTL link or any other type of tendon it would seem? If an Apollo missile simply needs coordinates then they never needed an FTL link -- if they can simply be given initial coordinates -- other than which target to destroy.


The Apollo system is capable of attacking what it's pointed at on it's own. The control links allow much better reaction to what the target does while the missile is in flight.

However, in this case the targets were utterly outclassed. Furthermore, it was only one salvo, there were no previous missiles to learn anything from and so one big reason for the link is gone. Going up against the SLN is like testing your self-drive car in an abandoned military base rather than in real traffic.
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Re: OK KZT: What's wrong with AAC?
Post by Loren Pechtel   » Tue May 10, 2022 1:24 am

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tlb wrote:The communication link is important (but less so with Apollo), however I do not believe it is ever stated that missiles are totally useless without that link nor is it ever stated that missiles have no sense of where they are. As Munroburton says, they are just much less effective without Apollo. I hope you are not thinking of the case after engine burn-out.


Remember Filareta's mass launch? That was presented as a standard last resort type of thing, it predates modern missile development. Thus even the original missiles have the ability to approximately follow a vector and attack whatever they find out there.

It's just that before Apollo they did a pretty poor job of it. Even with guidance missiles weren't good at staying on course over a long run.
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Re: OK KZT: What's wrong with AAC?
Post by Loren Pechtel   » Tue May 10, 2022 1:28 am

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ThinksMarkedly wrote:SS was initially a military secret, one that the US shared with the UK, so it was used very effectively during the Falklands War. The Argentines could neither jam RN transmissions nor even tell that transmissions were occurring (or at least that's what my professor said). SS was later declassified and was the basis of 2G CDMA cell phone networks (not the TDMA and GSM ones) and all of the 3G ones.


It's also at the heart of GPS, it had to have been declassified by the time civilian GPS existed.
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Re: OK KZT: What's wrong with AAC?
Post by ThinksMarkedly   » Tue May 10, 2022 12:32 pm

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Loren Pechtel wrote:It's just that before Apollo they did a pretty poor job of it. Even with guidance missiles weren't good at staying on course over a long run.


I'm pretty sure they stayed roughly on course. They're dumb, but not THAT dumb. We can tell our spacecraft today to fly in basically a straight or geodesic line without trouble.
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Re: OK KZT: What's wrong with AAC?
Post by Theemile   » Tue May 10, 2022 1:34 pm

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ThinksMarkedly wrote:
Loren Pechtel wrote:It's just that before Apollo they did a pretty poor job of it. Even with guidance missiles weren't good at staying on course over a long run.


I'm pretty sure they stayed roughly on course. They're dumb, but not THAT dumb. We can tell our spacecraft today to fly in basically a straight or geodesic line without trouble.


SDMs lost contact with their control craft, ran into each other's flight path, didn't lock on to their intended target or anything at all, and sometimes just mechanically failed. With a flight duration 3x as long (and in a salvo many times the size), the same issues are going to multiply - in addition to the target having 3x as long to get out of the seeker's window,
******
RFC said "refitting a Beowulfan SD to Manticoran standards would be just as difficult as refitting a standard SLN SD to those standards. In other words, it would be cheaper and faster to build new ships."
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Re: OK KZT: What's wrong with AAC?
Post by kzt   » Tue May 10, 2022 2:45 pm

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Well, there is only so much you can expect given the limited number of vacuum tubes that fit in a missile. ;)
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Re: OK KZT: What's wrong with AAC?
Post by ThinksMarkedly   » Tue May 10, 2022 10:14 pm

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kzt wrote:Well, there is only so much you can expect given the limited number of vacuum tubes that fit in a missile. ;)


I thought it was just one big vacuum tube with a warhead on one side and impeller rings on the other.
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Re: OK KZT: What's wrong with AAC?
Post by cthia   » Fri May 13, 2022 12:54 am

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Where exactly are the sensors located on missiles? Are they directly on the head? Or are they on the side? And is it a single sensor?

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
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Re: OK KZT: What's wrong with AAC?
Post by kzt   » Fri May 13, 2022 12:55 am

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cthia wrote:Where exactly are the sensors located on missiles? Are they directly on the head? Or are they on the side? And is it a single sensor?

There is a sketch somewhere. I'm pretty sure it's on the nose.
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