Guns, Guns Guns

HB of CJ wrote:HB of CJ (old coot) Post Captain. And there you have the truth.

Bullshit!

I expect that most of the US women buying guns for protection have very little training.
The bit about "clean air of relative freedom here in the USA" is rubbish. Being able to go out anywhere without having to carry a gun for protection is true freedom.

If I'm the "nitwit non intelligent leftist socialist", it's a pity we can't meet on a range sometime where I usually top score, or compare careers (military and civilian)(best real world test of intelligence), although I do admit to being a socialist (as are most citizens of the developed world.

Totally agree PeterZ. The early settlers in Australia were generally bastards in their treatment of our indigenous peoples.
An interesting discussion on the Muslim refugee culture problems is to compare how much sexual damage they have caused (miniscule) compared to the catholic clergy.

HB of CJ wrote:I did not understand how bad this Excellent David Weber Story Forum had gotten until I had been away for a couple of months. Outrageous. It would be best for this Forum if the POLITICAL sub forum be cut out and removed completely. We would all be less poisoned by the leftist bullshiet if it were. Respectfully.

HB of CJ (old coot) Post Captain. And there you have the truth.

So let me get this straight.

There are people here who voice opinions you disagree with. And your reaction to that fact is not to engage those in debate, take on those opinions and fight for your own interpretations of events, but rather to call upon higher authority to remove those dissenting voices so you don't have to deal with them?

Exactly what kind of "FREEDOM" is that, pray tell?

Donnachaidh wrote:The amount of bigotry and prejudice in that single sentence is staggering.

pokermind wrote:
Importing Muslim males from a Rape culture might have something to do with it.

Poker

There is a clear cultural divide between the way the western world sees women and the way the [middle-eastern] islamic world sees women. And that has a profound impact on the way the two cultures view violence against women.

Now the situation is that men from a culture where women are 2nd class citizens at best and property at worse have migrated to a very different culture.

The first question seems to be are the Islamic immigrants aware of this. I would stipulate that unless they are complete idiots they are aware of it. Of course in any group there are some complete idiots. It's a little hard to get an exact feeling for the % of total idiots but if you assume that 0.1% of the population is a total idiot and note that something like a million of them are in Germany that means Germany has imported about 1000 men who do not realize that that gender norms are different between the cultures.

The German government seems to be attempting to address it by cartoons such as this:



But other than the 1/1000 or so of Islamic immigrants who are such complete idiots that they don't already know it is forbidden, it doesn't really address the problem.



The larger problem is not so much that most of those choosing to ignore western cultural norms against mistreatment of women don't know that rules of how to treat women are vastly different between the societies. It's that a not so insignificant minority of the Islamic male refugees either do not care or deliberately chose to violate western cultural norms on treatment of women in a my islamic culture is superior to your western culture kind of way.

For example Cologne Imam Sami Abu-Yusuf "the events of New Year's Eve were the girls own fault, because they were half naked and wearing perfume. It is not surprising the men wanted to attack them. [Dressing like that] is like adding fuel to the fire"

Good comment Biochem.
I'd temper it a little though, in that not all cultures nor all men in the middle east disrespect women. Pakistan even elected a female president although the nutters did eventually kill her.
One of our self appointed muftis caused a stir by comparing western women to cat meat left out where the cat could get it.
Yet in the muslim families I have known mumma usually rules the roost.
Fortunately that dangerous minority you talk about usually don't have the guts to risk acting on their prejudices.

biochem wrote:The larger problem is not so much that most of those choosing to ignore western cultural norms against mistreatment of women don't know that rules of how to treat women are vastly different between the societies. It's that a not so insignificant minority of the Islamic male refugees either do not care or deliberately chose to violate western cultural norms on treatment of women in a my islamic culture is superior to your western culture kind of way.

For example Cologne Imam Sami Abu-Yusuf "the events of New Year's Eve were the girls own fault, because they were half naked and wearing perfume. It is not surprising the men wanted to attack them. [Dressing like that] is like adding fuel to the fire"

If you think victim blaming is something uniquely (or even predominantly) done by muslims, you are sadly and tragically mistaken.

I'm thinking certain people here should look at European culture.

Specifically catholic Europeans.

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Hey HB.

Yes. your women are so free with guns. Free to be sexaully assaulted at about 3 times that of german, austrian and Irish women, (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rape_statistics#Rape_statistics_by_country), free to be murdered at 5 to 10 times the rate of europeans, almost 3 times more likely to be domestically abused (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epidemiology_of_domestic_violence#International_levels), free to be prevented acces to birthcontrol and abortions which other countries have as a matter of course, and free to be downtrodden, beaten, and treated worse in the US than most of europe, including even in some former USSR states. So explain to me how free the US is again?

HB of CJ wrote:Hi, I am back. At least for a little while. This excellent forum is so full of leftist commie fecal material. Such an species arrogant assumption based on nitwit non intelligent leftist socialist assumptions that concealed carry permitted females would have ZERO extensive professional firearms training. Incredible.

Perhaps this is because most European posters here do not have a clue as to what it is like to live and breathe the clean air of relative freedom here in the USA. OUR FEMALE FAMILY MEMBERS enjoy a level of professional repetitive firearms training that greatly exceeds average law enforcement and our USA military training.

I did not understand how bad this Excellent David Weber Story Forum had gotten until I had been away for a couple of months. Outrageous. It would be best for this Forum if the POLITICAL sub forum be cut out and removed completely. We would all be less poisoned by the leftist bullshiet if it were. Respectfully.

HB of CJ (old coot) Post Captain. And there you have the truth.

These are same people that are willing to say a person is a bigot because we want rational and sane immigration. We are suppose to feel for the poor refugees that are fleeing conflict. It does not matter that they do not want to conform and/or fit into current society. Nor does it matter to liberal bleeding idiots that they believe US citizens should not be allowed to own weapons irregardless of our Constitutional rights. When they arguments fall short, they will attack the country and attack the messengers. Once, we had some say they will never come here to America because of gun laws and beliefs in God. Well my response is "Good Riddance!" Please go bother your own authorities and let us Americans try to sort out our culture and government.

smr wrote:We are suppose to feel for the poor refugees that are fleeing conflict. It does not matter that they do not want to conform and/or fit into current society.

You have a good point here about the responsibility of the refugees.

I believe that we as a godly society have a responsibility to help those fleeing conflict with the exception of non-disabled men of military age. However that help should not be string free. An important caveat and one which is being ignored by the authorities is that as you mention above the refugees have an obligation to fit into our society. It needs to be made very clear to them upon entry that that is the case. Unfortunately the governments so interested in looking good and appearing unbigoted that they are ignoring their obligations to their own citizens.

One commentary I read regarding the refugee situation a month or so ago, hit the nail on the head. It pointed out that the elites making these decisions are not the ones affected by them. They are safe and secure in their exclusive/gated communities with private security and don't experience the direct effect of their policies. The poor and lower middle class are the ones most impacted. Yet those classes are derided by the unaffected elites as being bigoted when they complain of the problems they experience directly.

Actually this sound similar to "the elites cause problems then deride those affected by them from unaffected enclaves" frustrations of Donald Trump voters. More countries may start seeing Donald Trump clones running if this keeps up.

biochem wrote:
You have a good point here about the responsibility of the refugees.

I believe that we as a godly society have a responsibility to help those fleeing conflict with the exception of non-disabled men of military age. However that help should not be string free. An important caveat and one which is being ignored by the authorities is that as you mention above the refugees have an obligation to fit into our society. It needs to be made very clear to them upon entry that that is the case. Unfortunately the governments so interested in looking good and appearing unbigoted that they are ignoring their obligations to their own citizens.

One commentary I read regarding the refugee situation a month or so ago, hit the nail on the head. It pointed out that the elites making these decisions are not the ones affected by them. They are safe and secure in their exclusive/gated communities with private security and don't experience the direct effect of their policies. The poor and lower middle class are the ones most impacted. Yet those classes are derided by the unaffected elites as being bigoted when they complain of the problems they experience directly.

Actually this sound similar to "the elites cause problems then deride those affected by them from unaffected enclaves" frustrations of Donald Trump voters. More countries may start seeing Donald Trump clones running if this keeps up.

Let's clarify this further. There are two sorts of refugees; economic refugees and religious and political refugees that are truly being persecuted.

As I see it the economic refugees are far down the list of those that need our help. Whatever short cuts to a seriously thorough screening process we develop needs to be applied to those that can prove they are being persecuted. People seeking a better life but are not subject to risk of life can wait in line.

This goes double of those people in Mexico wanting to hop the border.