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Honorverse ramblings and musings

Join us in talking discussing all things Honor, including (but not limited to) tactics, favorite characters, and book discussions.
Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by fallsfromtrees   » Fri Dec 05, 2014 4:49 pm

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cthia wrote:I'd like to know what a treecat's take is on the idea of a higher being. Nimitz should certainly be able to feel Honor's 'religious' emotions. Has Nimitz ever been to a worship service with Honor?

What an interesting memory song, it must have been, that first rendition of Christianity.

And I wonder who might have supplied that first notion, Stephanie Harrington?

Given that Honor has attended services in Harrington Steading many many times (from textev), it would be very surprising if Nimitz has not attended a worship service.
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Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by cthia   » Tue Dec 09, 2014 9:07 am

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I watched Star Trek's "Wrath of Khan' a-gain. When it got to the part of Spock giving Lt. Saavik the helm and letting her take the Enterprise out of docking status and away from the space station, Kirk was threatening to have his own bout with apoplexy.

It got me to thinking. Why do we not see a naval officer's first time at the helm? They're always already seasoned. But from whence did they acquire that seasoning? Surely it isn't all Sims.

I wonder how many officer's actually flew anything. We know Honor had her sail planes and older jet aircraft. Are all officers at least allowed, if not required, to demonstrate first-hand kinesthetic aptitude, and the humble skills of an air-breathing iron eagle?

Who wants a Captain that can't fly a cargo plane full of rubber dogshit out of Hong Kong without a stink?

Any textev regarding?

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
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Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by Jonathan_S   » Tue Dec 09, 2014 12:30 pm

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cthia wrote:I watched Star Trek's "Wrath of Khan' a-gain. When it got to the part of Spock giving Lt. Saavik the helm and letting her take the Enterprise out of docking status and away from the space station, Kirk was threatening to have his own bout with apoplexy.

It got me to thinking. Why do we not see a naval officer's first time at the helm? They're always already seasoned. But from whence did they acquire that seasoning? Surely it isn't all Sims.

I wonder how many officer's actually flew anything. We know Honor had her sail planes and older jet aircraft. Are all officers at least allowed, if not required, to demonstrate first-hand kinesthetic aptitude, and the humble skills of an air-breathing iron eagle?

Who wants a Captain that can't fly a cargo plane full of rubber dogshit out of Hong Kong without a stink?

Any textev regarding?
Not that I can recall. But I'm sure they have a well planned curriculum and progression for how you're trained to be a helmsman.

At a guess once you graduate from computer sims you'd get taken up to a training craft - possibly something like an older LAC that can be configured to handle like a variety of starships (kind of like NASA had a Gulfstream II bizjet modified into the Shuttle Training Aircraft that can "fly" like the Space Shuttle on landing approach) - by having the computers restrict its acceleration and roll rates it could maneuver like anything from a LAC to an SD(P) to a lumbering freighter.

And I'd bet that you start out driving it well away from anything breakable, then practice approaches on something expendable (in case you sideswipe it with your wedge) well before you're allowed to handle active wedge anywhere near a station or other ship.

But what exactly the training involves before being allowed to touch the helm of a spaceship I wouldn't even guess.
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Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by Vince   » Tue Dec 09, 2014 10:48 pm

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Jonathan_S wrote:
cthia wrote:I watched Star Trek's "Wrath of Khan' a-gain. When it got to the part of Spock giving Lt. Saavik the helm and letting her take the Enterprise out of docking status and away from the space station, Kirk was threatening to have his own bout with apoplexy.

It got me to thinking. Why do we not see a naval officer's first time at the helm? They're always already seasoned. But from whence did they acquire that seasoning? Surely it isn't all Sims.

I wonder how many officer's actually flew anything. We know Honor had her sail planes and older jet aircraft. Are all officers at least allowed, if not required, to demonstrate first-hand kinesthetic aptitude, and the humble skills of an air-breathing iron eagle?

Who wants a Captain that can't fly a cargo plane full of rubber dogshit out of Hong Kong without a stink?

Any textev regarding?
Not that I can recall. But I'm sure they have a well planned curriculum and progression for how you're trained to be a helmsman.

At a guess once you graduate from computer sims you'd get taken up to a training craft - possibly something like an older LAC that can be configured to handle like a variety of starships (kind of like NASA had a Gulfstream II bizjet modified into the Shuttle Training Aircraft that can "fly" like the Space Shuttle on landing approach) - by having the computers restrict its acceleration and roll rates it could maneuver like anything from a LAC to an SD(P) to a lumbering freighter.

And I'd bet that you start out driving it well away from anything breakable, then practice approaches on something expendable (in case you sideswipe it with your wedge) well before you're allowed to handle active wedge anywhere near a station or other ship.

But what exactly the training involves before being allowed to touch the helm of a spaceship I wouldn't even guess.

Obligated Service by Joelle Presby in Beginnings, Worlds of Honor #6 has GSN Ensign Cecelie Rustin taking the helm of the Joseph class destroyer Manasseh in for docking at a Masadan space station. What Ensign Rustin says to fellow Ensign Claire Bedlam Lecroix afterwards is hilarious:

“But I scratched up the ship. My first time driving and I scratched it all up.”
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History does not repeat itself so much as it echoes.
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Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by cthia   » Wed Dec 10, 2014 9:00 am

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Jonathan_S wrote:
cthia wrote:I watched Star Trek's "Wrath of Khan' a-gain. When it got to the part of Spock giving Lt. Saavik the helm and letting her take the Enterprise out of docking status and away from the space station, Kirk was threatening to have his own bout with apoplexy.

It got me to thinking. Why do we not see a naval officer's first time at the helm? They're always already seasoned. But from whence did they acquire that seasoning? Surely it isn't all Sims.

I wonder how many officer's actually flew anything. We know Honor had her sail planes and older jet aircraft. Are all officers at least allowed, if not required, to demonstrate first-hand kinesthetic aptitude, and the humble skills of an air-breathing iron eagle?

Who wants a Captain that can't fly a cargo plane full of rubber dogshit out of Hong Kong without a stink?

Any textev regarding?


Not that I can recall. But I'm sure they have a well planned curriculum and progression for how you're trained to be a helmsman.

At a guess once you graduate from computer sims you'd get taken up to a training craft - possibly something like an older LAC that can be configured to handle like a variety of starships (kind of like NASA had a Gulfstream II bizjet modified into the Shuttle Training Aircraft that can "fly" like the Space Shuttle on landing approach) - by having the computers restrict its acceleration and roll rates it could maneuver like anything from a LAC to an SD(P) to a lumbering freighter.

And I'd bet that you start out driving it well away from anything breakable, then practice approaches on something expendable (in case you sideswipe it with your wedge) well before you're allowed to handle active wedge anywhere near a station or other ship.

But what exactly the training involves before being allowed to touch the helm of a spaceship I wouldn't even guess.

Vince wrote:Obligated Service by Joelle Presby in Beginnings, Worlds of Honor #6 has GSN Ensign Cecelie Rustin taking the helm of the Joseph class destroyer Manasseh in for docking at a Masadan space station. What Ensign Rustin says to fellow Ensign Claire Bedlam Lecroix afterwards is hilarious:

“But I scratched up the ship. My first time driving and I scratched it all up.”


Thanks for this post Vince. It's good for a laugh. It seems there'd be more of this. Not everyone entering the Navy would have the same level of experiences.

Edit:
Added to my thoughts after watching the above mentioned movie was remembering when Honor took over manual, joystick, control over Fearless against Saladin in the end game.

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
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Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by Vince   » Wed Dec 10, 2014 10:38 am

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cthia wrote:
Vince wrote:Obligated Service by Joelle Presby in Beginnings, Worlds of Honor #6 has GSN Ensign Cecelie Rustin taking the helm of the Joseph class destroyer Manasseh in for docking at a Masadan space station. What Ensign Rustin says to fellow Ensign Claire Bedlam Lecroix afterwards is hilarious:

“But I scratched up the ship. My first time driving and I scratched it all up.”


Thanks for this post Vince. It's good for a laugh. It seems there'd be more of this. Not everyone entering the Navy would have the same level of experiences.

Edit:
Added to my thoughts after watching the above mentioned movie was remembering when Honor took over manual, joystick, control over Fearless against Saladin in the end game.

I think you mean CL Fearless against the Peep Q-ship Sirius in On Basilisk Station, not CA Fearless against the Masadan BC Thunder of God (formerly the Peep BC Saladin).
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Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by cthia   » Wed Dec 10, 2014 10:51 am

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cthia wrote:
Vince wrote:Obligated Service by Joelle Presby in Beginnings, Worlds of Honor #6 has GSN Ensign Cecelie Rustin taking the helm of the Joseph class destroyer Manasseh in for docking at a Masadan space station. What Ensign Rustin says to fellow Ensign Claire Bedlam Lecroix afterwards is hilarious:

“But I scratched up the ship. My first time driving and I scratched it all up.”


Thanks for this post Vince. It's good for a laugh. It seems there'd be more of this. Not everyone entering the Navy would have the same level of experiences.

Edit:
Added to my thoughts after watching the above mentioned movie was remembering when Honor took over manual, joystick, control over Fearless against Saladin in the end game.

Vince wrote:I think you mean CL Fearless against the Peep Q-ship Sirius in On Basilisk Station, not CA Fearless against the Masadan BC Thunder of God (formerly the Peep BC Saladin).

Yeppers. Indeed I do. Always mix the two up.

Thanks Vince.

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
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Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by cthia   » Wed Dec 17, 2014 5:42 pm

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wiki wrote:The sentience scale was a numeric scale used by humans to rate the intelligence of various species.
◾ Alphane and Medusan intelligence was comparable to that of humans.
◾ Treecats of Sphinx: ◾ real intelligence ≈ 1.00
◾ dissimulation[1] = 0.83

◾ Gremlins of Beowulf < 0.83 (slightly)
◾ Dolphins of Earth < 0.83 (slightly)
◾ Amphors of Barstool = 0.70 (SK1)
◾ Barthoni ? [2]

Other animals that might also be considered a sentient species:
◾ the herbivorous Growlers, a degenerated form of the Alphanes. (HHA1.2: AGT)
◾ the carnivorous Gilgamesh River Devils, a semi-sentient animal species. (HHA4.4: LGTP)

Note Edit:
There were twenty-seven sentient nonhuman species discovered to 1920 PD. (Companion)

Does textev state where Solarians are on this scale? :lol:


Could the MAlign be hiding amongst the Alphane worlds?
wiki wrote:The Alphanes were an ancient race of sentient beings who occupied a number of worlds[1] at least one hundred millenia before humans settled in the same area.

They used an advanced crystal-growing technology, of which only a few relics remained in the Post Diaspora era. Their books were holographic crystals that were activated using alternating current power.

Kalpriades' Survey of the Alphane Worlds was a book about the planets once populated by the species.

Human scientists had no sure knowledge of what the Alphanes actually looked like, but believed them to be bipedal reptilians, perhaps related to the Growlers.[2] (HHA1.2: AGT)

References Edit

1.↑ Two of these worlds were Hope (formerly Salamis) and Tesserow.
2.↑ The Alphanes make their only appearance in the short story "A Grand Tour" by David Drake. No other Honorverse material mentions them.

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
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Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by cthia   » Wed Dec 17, 2014 9:02 pm

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We were discussing, mere days ago, in a thread regarding orphaned missiles. I stumbled upon this just now ...

http://www.davidweber.net/posts/view/14 ... ection:asc

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
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Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by JeffEngel   » Wed Dec 17, 2014 9:09 pm

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cthia wrote:
wiki wrote:The sentience scale was a numeric scale used by humans to rate the intelligence of various species.
◾ Alphane and Medusan intelligence was comparable to that of humans.
◾ Treecats of Sphinx: ◾ real intelligence ≈ 1.00
◾ dissimulation[1] = 0.83

◾ Gremlins of Beowulf < 0.83 (slightly)
◾ Dolphins of Earth < 0.83 (slightly)
◾ Amphors of Barstool = 0.70 (SK1)
◾ Barthoni ? [2]

Other animals that might also be considered a sentient species:
◾ the herbivorous Growlers, a degenerated form of the Alphanes. (HHA1.2: AGT)
◾ the carnivorous Gilgamesh River Devils, a semi-sentient animal species. (HHA4.4: LGTP)

Note Edit:
There were twenty-seven sentient nonhuman species discovered to 1920 PD. (Companion)

Does textev state where Solarians are on this scale? :lol:

Solarians are comparable to humans too. The comparison is considered rude, but, eh, within generous guidelines that apply in a discipline like this...
Could the MAlign be hiding amongst the Alphane worlds?

It can't be ruled out, but the Alphane worlds we've seen would make for lousy hiding places. A bunch of well-off, not-that-kooky strangers showing up at a time would stand out badly, and the Alphane worlds still get enough traffic that you'd have a hiding place that's not private enough while not getting nearly enough traffic for you, or your messages in and out, to melt in.
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