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TFT *SPOILERS* thoughts, discussions, and future speculation

This fascinating series is a combination of historical seafaring, swashbuckling adventure, and high technological science-fiction. Join us in a discussion!
TFT *SPOILERS* thoughts, discussions, and future speculation
Post by PlaysWithBees   » Tue Jan 08, 2019 1:43 pm

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After finishing, I have a couple thoughts:

1 Seamount: I’m glad he was told, sad but understanding how he died, and almost upset that he didn’t get an electronic personality made before that to join Nahrmahn and Owl in virtual R&D.

2 project Androcles was an interesting twist. It can be a great way to start fracturing the dogma of CoGA... or turn around and bite the IC in the arse with unintended consequences. Be interesting to watch.

3 Nimue Garvahi: once again a book goes by without her doing the daring rescue or cutting loose in a no-holds-barred unarmed brawl :cry: Another lost opportunity.

4 unanswered questions: who was the “one other” who knew about Nimue and did they really die with the commodore?
What IS in the Key of Schueler?
Will Kohdy or his legacy yet play a role? (Is it his actual body buried or a simulacrum? Was an EP created of him?)

Let the speculation begin! :D
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Re: TFT *SPOILERS* thoughts, discussions, and future specula
Post by Jeslis   » Tue Jan 08, 2019 4:45 pm

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I should lead by saying I greatly appreciate the book, the story, the author (not in this order), and by no means am I disappointed in the book. Everyone's a critic.

That being said;

- The books timeframe (aprox 15 years) goes by SO quickly compared to other books which usually encompassed maybe 2 years.. it felt very weird.
((For those who may not know, it was mentioned, and I am paraphrasing my understand of this; that this is because RFC originally wrote an introduction for the 'original book', that tried to cover the 'last 20 years' since the end of the jihad.. but it ended up being so long that he ended up scrapping ~60k words? and rewriting it as the book we have now.))

- Much like the reviews of the recent Marvel infinity war movie, the book felt like an unending funeral. Thankfully most deaths were of natural causes, but I almost wish it wasn't described in so many words. It was very saddening.

- There is a lack of naval combat that I wasn't expecting. Obviously no one has a navy yet, but not even a quip/POV of a fire support mission from a Naval vessel supporting a land engagement. ((This is probably due to my lack of map knowledge of Safehold, and there being no wars anywhere near blue water.))

2 things I was curious about;

It's mentioned a few times that others that have been 'told' the truth have rejected it, and are now guests in Nimue's Cave. Who are these others? Is it just a plot device to allow the author freedom down the road? Being let into the inner circle is usually a 'big deal', so I was surprised it wasn't mentioned who these people were.

I really wanted to know more about the temple, and was dismayed how generally it was described (and then never mentioned again).. I know it was passive sensors only, but I was looking forward to knowing a bit more about the hidden devices.. what the key from paityr(sp?) actually does, or interacts with, or, or, or.... etc..
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Re: TFT *SPOILERS* thoughts, discussions, and future specula
Post by evilauthor   » Wed Jan 09, 2019 10:53 am

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This book IS a tad unfocused since it's covering so many years. I can't help but wonder if it would have been formatted as a short story anthology, with each short story (or novella) focused on one particular plot thread.

OTOH...

One of things that makes the Tragedy of Siddarmark so tragic is how you can SEE the rest of the world improving and prospering (yes, even places like Desnair and South Harchong) while Siddarmark totters along like a zombie. You could practically see Cayleb at the end there practically give up on the country because it's the one place he's been unable to help despite persistently trying to for so long. I can't help but wonder if Siddarmark is being set up as some kind of future Nazi Germany/Soviet Union/Roman Empire type antagonist for the future, yet another failed democracy-turned-empire.

Edit: OTOH, the battle with the Great Dragons was a nice bit of action. "Splashy", heh.
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Re: TFT *SPOILERS* thoughts, discussions, and future specula
Post by DrakBibliophile   » Wed Jan 09, 2019 11:53 am

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The "Battle with the Great Dragons" was great and I enjoyed Merlin's "Opps, I did it again attitude".

Fortunately, the Revealing The Truth to the kids didn't have a bad result. ;)


evilauthor wrote:This book IS a tad unfocused since it's covering so many years. I can't help but wonder if it would have been formatted as a short story anthology, with each short story (or novella) focused on one particular plot thread.

OTOH...

One of things that makes the Tragedy of Siddarmark so tragic is how you can SEE the rest of the world improving and prospering (yes, even places like Desnair and South Harchong) while Siddarmark totters along like a zombie. You could practically see Cayleb at the end there practically give up on the country because it's the one place he's been unable to help despite persistently trying to for so long. I can't help but wonder if Siddarmark is being set up as some kind of future Nazi Germany/Soviet Union/Roman Empire type antagonist for the future, yet another failed democracy-turned-empire.

Edit: OTOH, the battle with the Great Dragons was a nice bit of action. "Splashy", heh.
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Paul Howard (Alias Drak Bibliophile)
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Sometimes The Dragon Wins! [Polite Dragon Smile]
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Re: TFT *SPOILERS* thoughts, discussions, and future specula
Post by isaac_newton   » Wed Jan 09, 2019 11:56 am

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[quote="evilauthor"] SNIP
One of things that makes the Tragedy of Siddarmark so tragic is how you can SEE the rest of the world improving and prospering (yes, even places like Desnair and South Harchong) while Siddarmark totters along like a zombie. You could practically see Cayleb at the end there practically give up on the country because it's the one place he's been unable to help despite persistently trying to for so long. I can't help but wonder if Siddarmark is being set up as some kind of future Nazi Germany/Soviet Union/Roman Empire type antagonist for the future, yet another failed democracy-turned-empire.

SNIP //quote]

Yup - that was really not was I was expecting at all!
bit of a bummer!

I suppose it shows - although broad sweeps/movements in human history are true, that particular humans in particular places can have a crucial impact too!
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Re: TFT *SPOILERS* thoughts, discussions, and future specula
Post by AJNolte   » Wed Jan 09, 2019 12:18 pm

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isaac_newton wrote:
evilauthor wrote: SNIP
One of things that makes the Tragedy of Siddarmark so tragic is how you can SEE the rest of the world improving and prospering (yes, even places like Desnair and South Harchong) while Siddarmark totters along like a zombie. You could practically see Cayleb at the end there practically give up on the country because it's the one place he's been unable to help despite persistently trying to for so long. I can't help but wonder if Siddarmark is being set up as some kind of future Nazi Germany/Soviet Union/Roman Empire type antagonist for the future, yet another failed democracy-turned-empire.

SNIP //quote]

Yup - that was really not was I was expecting at all!
bit of a bummer!

I suppose it shows - although broad sweeps/movements in human history are true, that particular humans in particular places can have a crucial impact too!


The parallel Zhermo puts me most in mind of is Hugo Chavez, actually. Not sure if it's deliberate on Mr. Weber's part, but the "middling military officer comes to power blaming the country's problems on native elites and economically powerful allies" parallels are... really close.

I couldn't help but note the areas that are most resistant to his message: Glacierheart and the southmarch. I've got a bad feeling that both areas are going to tell him to take a hike when he tries to expropriate all Charisian property within them, which will lead to... considerable unpleasantness.

Particularly in Glacierheart. I mean, we didn't hear anything from or about Burk Rhaymond the entire book, but he was both a Charisian and a Brigadeer in the Glacierheart volunteers. They're not gonna forget that, particularly if he stayed there after the war. And while the Sword of Schueller caught the Glacierhearters off-guard, no action Protector Zhermo might hypothetically take against them in the future's going to be that much of a surprise. So, if all that speculation comes to pass...well, I wouldn't want to wage a counter-insurgency campaign against Glacierheart if they had any kind of time to prepare.

Ultimately, of course, that probably makes relations between Charis and Siddarmark worse, since Zhermo's going to blame the Charisians for any Glacierheart insurgency that springs up, whether they have anything to do with it or not.

Anyway, gonna be ugly.
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Re: TFT *SPOILERS* thoughts, discussions, and future specula
Post by Dilandu   » Wed Jan 09, 2019 2:37 pm

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Seems a bit... strange, that 15+ years have passed, and nobody outside Charis still didn't figured out how to build at least simple steam engines. Did not correspond with RFC-claimed high level of Safeholdian metallurgy.
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P.S. - And he have Russian twin, to watch his back)
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Re: TFT *SPOILERS* thoughts, discussions, and future specula
Post by GregD   » Wed Jan 09, 2019 5:23 pm

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Jeslis wrote:- There is a lack of naval combat that I wasn't expecting. Obviously no one has a navy yet, but not even a quip/POV of a fire support mission from a Naval vessel supporting a land engagement.


A couple of warlords tried to attack Earl River Waters. The AoG and a Charisian Destroyer that "luckily happened to be in the area" crushed the attack. Did you miss that?
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Re: TFT *SPOILERS* thoughts, discussions, and future specula
Post by Jeslis   » Wed Jan 09, 2019 7:18 pm

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GregD wrote:
Jeslis wrote:- There is a lack of naval combat that I wasn't expecting. Obviously no one has a navy yet, but not even a quip/POV of a fire support mission from a Naval vessel supporting a land engagement.


A couple of warlords tried to attack Earl River Waters. The AoG and a Charisian Destroyer that "luckily happened to be in the area" crushed the attack. Did you miss that?


Err, I must have.

Most of the Harchong stuff seemed to be minor skirmishes, and one 'slightly' bigger battle at the end after the weapons were received via airship... ((as well as all the political maneuvering and wedding))..

Can you give me an indication of % page number? (eg; if you have a hardback with 970 pages, and its on page 97, its 10% in.)

Barring that, can you give me 2-3 direct quote words that I can use to search for the section on my e-reader.
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Re: TFT *SPOILERS* thoughts, discussions, and future specula
Post by evilauthor   » Wed Jan 09, 2019 8:08 pm

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Dilandu wrote:Seems a bit... strange, that 15+ years have passed, and nobody outside Charis still didn't figured out how to build at least simple steam engines. Did not correspond with RFC-claimed high level of Safeholdian metallurgy.


Wsit... I thought Desnair and Dohlar at least were producing their own "automotives" by the end of the book.

Also, the problem with steam engines isn't metallurgy. It's tolerances and standards, aka, making sure all your parts fit together properly and doing so on a mass production scale.
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