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***Major Spoiler*** The ending scene of Through Fiery Trials

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Re: ***Major Spoiler*** The ending scene of Through Fiery Tr
Post by Robert_A_Woodward   » Sun Jun 30, 2019 12:11 am

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WeberFan wrote:After reading and contemplating all the posts in this thread, I offer up the following TEXTEV - which I personally consider pretty definitive...

(Emphasis mine)

August Year of God 915.II. Imperial Palace, City of Cherayth, Kingdom of Chisholm, Empire of Charis.

"You're right," Nahrmahn agreed. "And, speaking of archangels that haven't turned up yet, Owl and I would like to show you what we've been working on with Paityr and Nynian to kick off the final phase of the 'Nahrmahn Plan.'" His avatar's smile was remarkably broad ... and evil. "Somehow, I think the real Schueler's going to be spinning in his grave."


Those who think that the "Book of Schueler" was created by the Inner Circle think that passage is definitive. The rest of us think that it is a red herring.
----------------------------
Beowulf was bad.
(first sentence of Chapter VI of _Space Viking_ by H. Beam Piper)
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Re: ***Major Spoiler*** The ending scene of Through Fiery Tr
Post by wingfield   » Mon Jul 01, 2019 3:02 am

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WeberFan wrote:After reading and contemplating all the posts in this thread, I offer up the following TEXTEV - which I personally consider pretty definitive...

(Emphasis mine)

August Year of God 915.II. Imperial Palace, City of Cherayth, Kingdom of Chisholm, Empire of Charis.

"You're right," Nahrmahn agreed. "And, speaking of archangels that haven't turned up yet, Owl and I would like to show you what we've been working on with Paityr and Nynian to kick off the final phase of the 'Nahrmahn Plan.'" His avatar's smile was remarkably broad ... and evil. "Somehow, I think the real Schueler's going to be spinning in his grave."

Our esteemed fellow posters remain in denial about this quote!
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Re: ***Major Spoiler*** The ending scene of Through Fiery Tr
Post by PeterZ   » Mon Jul 01, 2019 7:36 am

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Posts: 6306
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WeberFan wrote:After reading and contemplating all the posts in this thread, I offer up the following TEXTEV - which I personally consider pretty definitive...

(Emphasis mine)

August Year of God 915.II. Imperial Palace, City of Cherayth, Kingdom of Chisholm, Empire of Charis.

"You're right," Nahrmahn agreed. "And, speaking of archangels that haven't turned up yet, Owl and I would like to show you what we've been working on with Paityr and Nynian to kick off the final phase of the 'Nahrmahn Plan.'" His avatar's smile was remarkably broad ... and evil. "Somehow, I think the real Schueler's going to be spinning in his grave."
wingfield wrote:Our esteemed fellow posters remain in denial about this quote!

Some posters aren't able to recognize curveballs let alone hit one!
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Re: ***Major Spoiler*** The ending scene of Through Fiery Tr
Post by Magistos   » Mon Jul 01, 2019 7:47 am

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PeterZ wrote:
WeberFan wrote:After reading and contemplating all the posts in this thread, I offer up the following TEXTEV - which I personally consider pretty definitive...

(Emphasis mine)

August Year of God 915.II. Imperial Palace, City of Cherayth, Kingdom of Chisholm, Empire of Charis.

"You're right," Nahrmahn agreed. "And, speaking of archangels that haven't turned up yet, Owl and I would like to show you what we've been working on with Paityr and Nynian to kick off the final phase of the 'Nahrmahn Plan.'" His avatar's smile was remarkably broad ... and evil. "Somehow, I think the real Schueler's going to be spinning in his grave."
wingfield wrote:Our esteemed fellow posters remain in denial about this quote!

Some posters aren't able to recognize curveballs let alone hit one!


Some of us are just playing Frisbee golf and watching the fireworks. ;)
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Re: ***Major Spoiler*** The ending scene of Through Fiery Tr
Post by WeberFan   » Mon Jul 01, 2019 3:28 pm

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Posts: 325
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PeterZ wrote:
WeberFan wrote:After reading and contemplating all the posts in this thread, I offer up the following TEXTEV - which I personally consider pretty definitive...

(Emphasis mine)

August Year of God 915.II. Imperial Palace, City of Cherayth, Kingdom of Chisholm, Empire of Charis.

"You're right," Nahrmahn agreed. "And, speaking of archangels that haven't turned up yet, Owl and I would like to show you what we've been working on with Paityr and Nynian to kick off the final phase of the 'Nahrmahn Plan.'" His avatar's smile was remarkably broad ... and evil. "Somehow, I think the real Schueler's going to be spinning in his grave."
wingfield wrote:Our esteemed fellow posters remain in denial about this quote!

Some posters aren't able to recognize curveballs let alone hit one!

Personally, I think it's just a question of perception... Sometimes with Himself, a quote is just a quote. But other times, a quote is... to quote a previous respondent: "a red herring." As for me, I don't think it is IN THIS CASE. But I understand and accept that someone else can have a different opinion... unlike our politics, reasonable people can disagree - reasonably...
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Re: ***Major Spoiler*** The ending scene of Through Fiery Tr
Post by Julia Minor   » Tue Jul 02, 2019 10:47 am

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Posts: 121
Joined: Mon Aug 06, 2018 12:58 pm

WeberFan wrote:After reading and contemplating all the posts in this thread, I offer up the following TEXTEV - which I personally consider pretty definitive...

(Emphasis mine)

August Year of God 915.II. Imperial Palace, City of Cherayth, Kingdom of Chisholm, Empire of Charis.

"You're right," Nahrmahn agreed. "And, speaking of archangels that haven't turned up yet, Owl and I would like to show you what we've been working on with Paityr and Nynian to kick off the final phase of the 'Nahrmahn Plan.'" His avatar's smile was remarkably broad ... and evil. "Somehow, I think the real Schueler's going to be spinning in his grave."


Considering that as far as the Inner Circle knows, Schueler was a hardcore Langhorne/Chihiro loyalist, anything the IC did to break the Temple's hold would be expected to hack off Schueler.

I'll grant that the phrasing here indicates that Nahrmahn and Owl are planning some sort of imposture. But that covers a lot of ground, there's a lot of things they could be planning that aren't the Testimony of Schueler.
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Re: ***Major Spoiler*** The ending scene of Through Fiery Tr
Post by PeterZ   » Wed Jul 03, 2019 6:01 pm

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Posts: 6306
Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2011 12:11 pm
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WeberFan wrote:After reading and contemplating all the posts in this thread, I offer up the following TEXTEV - which I personally consider pretty definitive...

(Emphasis mine)

August Year of God 915.II. Imperial Palace, City of Cherayth, Kingdom of Chisholm, Empire of Charis.

"You're right," Nahrmahn agreed. "And, speaking of archangels that haven't turned up yet, Owl and I would like to show you what we've been working on with Paityr and Nynian to kick off the final phase of the 'Nahrmahn Plan.'" His avatar's smile was remarkably broad ... and evil. "Somehow, I think the real Schueler's going to be spinning in his grave."
wingfield wrote:Our esteemed fellow posters remain in denial about this quote!
PeterZ wrote:Some posters aren't able to recognize curveballs let alone hit one!
WeberFan wrote:Personally, I think it's just a question of perception... Sometimes with Himself, a quote is just a quote. But other times, a quote is... to quote a previous respondent: "a red herring." As for me, I don't think it is IN THIS CASE. But I understand and accept that someone else can have a different opinion... unlike our politics, reasonable people can disagree - reasonably...

The first chapter of TFT (after the prologue), Merlin's thoughts assert that the IC could not afford to rekindle any lingering beliefs that every from Charis was spawned from Shan-wei. Attacking the CoGA doctrine had to avoid accusations of being Shan-wei's handiwork. Faking a visitation would court just that accusation when the archangels do return. And the archangels WILL return. Everything stemming from a faked visitation would discredit ANYTHING coming from Charis.

They aren't going there. Whatever the IC uses to ridicule or discredit the archangels will have to be a doctrinal dispute. Falsifying what the archangels say or do in any way simply confirms that Charis was captive to the Mother of Lies. That charge will put paid to anything stemming from a falsified visitation. That's is just too high a price to pay for swaying a plurality or even a majority of Safeholdians to give credence to CoC theology.
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Re: ***Major Spoiler*** The ending scene of Through Fiery Tr
Post by ssl4000g   » Wed Jul 03, 2019 6:53 pm

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PeterZ wrote:
WeberFan wrote:After reading and contemplating all the posts in this thread, I offer up the following TEXTEV - which I personally consider pretty definitive...

(Emphasis mine)

August Year of God 915.II. Imperial Palace, City of Cherayth, Kingdom of Chisholm, Empire of Charis.

"You're right," Nahrmahn agreed. "And, speaking of archangels that haven't turned up yet, Owl and I would like to show you what we've been working on with Paityr and Nynian to kick off the final phase of the 'Nahrmahn Plan.'" His avatar's smile was remarkably broad ... and evil. "Somehow, I think the real Schueler's going to be spinning in his grave."
wingfield wrote:Our esteemed fellow posters remain in denial about this quote!
PeterZ wrote:Some posters aren't able to recognize curveballs let alone hit one!
WeberFan wrote:Personally, I think it's just a question of perception... Sometimes with Himself, a quote is just a quote. But other times, a quote is... to quote a previous respondent: "a red herring." As for me, I don't think it is IN THIS CASE. But I understand and accept that someone else can have a different opinion... unlike our politics, reasonable people can disagree - reasonably...

The first chapter of TFT (after the prologue), Merlin's thoughts assert that the IC could not afford to rekindle any lingering beliefs that every from Charis was spawned from Shan-wei. Attacking the CoGA doctrine had to avoid accusations of being Shan-wei's handiwork. Faking a visitation would court just that accusation when the archangels do return. And the archangels WILL return. Everything stemming from a faked visitation would discredit ANYTHING coming from Charis.

They aren't going there. Whatever the IC uses to ridicule or discredit the archangels will have to be a doctrinal dispute. Falsifying what the archangels say or do in any way simply confirms that Charis was captive to the Mother of Lies. That charge will put paid to anything stemming from a falsified visitation. That's is just too high a price to pay for swaying a plurality or even a majority of Safeholdians to give credence to CoC theology.

I'd like to continue on the point Peter was making; shortly after the text peter quoted, Merlin compliments Nahrmahn on the deviousness of his contribution to "the Nahrmahn Plan". (The section we are speaking of is the end of November 890 section), the text goes on to describe Charis giving away their technology so that it is everywhere and unmistakable to any returning Archangel. It is further mentioned that Ehdwyrd will have a tough go convincing his board to basically 'give away' their tech to make this happen.

Their ambition to flood the world with innovation/technology that when the Return happens, the tech genie will be out of the bottle and they will circumvent the returning Archangel(s) from creating another Armageddon Reef our of the whole planet. I offer that this is the Nahrmahn Plan.

I've read through, over time, this very long thread and I do not recall seeing this exact text mentioned. I thought it was strong, and offer it up for discussion. For those who have the hard cover, pages 30 and 31 close November 890 and it is here where both Peter and I are pulling our reference.

The section from 915 quoted above? Not ready to tackle that one...yet. :|

W
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Re: ***Major Spoiler*** The ending scene of Through Fiery Tr
Post by Loren Pechtel   » Wed Jul 03, 2019 9:12 pm

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PlaysWithBees wrote:Regarding an underwater base.

The greatest consequence of an OBS strike, would be the resulting mega-tsunami. Simple large earthquakes have caused significant waves to cross the pacific and do significant damage on the other side.

The lateral forces resulting from such a bombardment as is being proposed coupled with smaller oceans on Safehold, would be like multiple Yucatán-level meteor impacts. Anything within miles of the surrounding coast.... ALL of the coast.... would be washed off the map! Add in the cubic kilometers of vaporized sea water in the atmosphere screwing up the climate patterns and you are looking potentially at an extinction event that likely would include humanity as well as much of the flora and fauna on the planet.


Why would you get a tsunami? The OBS doesn't cause one mega-hit, it causes a whole bunch of smaller hits--you'll get many waves, not big waves.
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Re: ***Major Spoiler*** The ending scene of Through Fiery Tr
Post by PeterZ   » Wed Jul 03, 2019 10:44 pm

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Posts: 6306
Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2011 12:11 pm
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WeberFan wrote:After reading and contemplating all the posts in this thread, I offer up the following TEXTEV - which I personally consider pretty definitive...

(Emphasis mine)

August Year of God 915.II. Imperial Palace, City of Cherayth, Kingdom of Chisholm, Empire of Charis.

"You're right," Nahrmahn agreed. "And, speaking of archangels that haven't turned up yet, Owl and I would like to show you what we've been working on with Paityr and Nynian to kick off the final phase of the 'Nahrmahn Plan.'" His avatar's smile was remarkably broad ... and evil. "Somehow, I think the real Schueler's going to be spinning in his grave."
wingfield wrote:Our esteemed fellow posters remain in denial about this quote!
PeterZ wrote:Some posters aren't able to recognize curveballs let alone hit one!
WeberFan wrote:Personally, I think it's just a question of perception... Sometimes with Himself, a quote is just a quote. But other times, a quote is... to quote a previous respondent: "a red herring." As for me, I don't think it is IN THIS CASE. But I understand and accept that someone else can have a different opinion... unlike our politics, reasonable people can disagree - reasonably...
PeterZ wrote:The first chapter of TFT (after the prologue), Merlin's thoughts assert that the IC could not afford to rekindle any lingering beliefs that every from Charis was spawned from Shan-wei. Attacking the CoGA doctrine had to avoid accusations of being Shan-wei's handiwork. Faking a visitation would court just that accusation when the archangels do return. And the archangels WILL return. Everything stemming from a faked visitation would discredit ANYTHING coming from Charis.

They aren't going there. Whatever the IC uses to ridicule or discredit the archangels will have to be a doctrinal dispute. Falsifying what the archangels say or do in any way simply confirms that Charis was captive to the Mother of Lies. That charge will put paid to anything stemming from a falsified visitation. That's is just too high a price to pay for swaying a plurality or even a majority of Safeholdians to give credence to CoC theology.
ssl4000g wrote:I'd like to continue on the point Peter was making; shortly after the text peter quoted, Merlin compliments Nahrmahn on the deviousness of his contribution to "the Nahrmahn Plan". (The section we are speaking of is the end of November 890 section), the text goes on to describe Charis giving away their technology so that it is everywhere and unmistakable to any returning Archangel. It is further mentioned that Ehdwyrd will have a tough go convincing his board to basically 'give away' their tech to make this happen.

Their ambition to flood the world with innovation/technology that when the Return happens, the tech genie will be out of the bottle and they will circumvent the returning Archangel(s) from creating another Armageddon Reef our of the whole planet. I offer that this is the Nahrmahn Plan.

I've read through, over time, this very long thread and I do not recall seeing this exact text mentioned. I thought it was strong, and offer it up for discussion. For those who have the hard cover, pages 30 and 31 close November 890 and it is here where both Peter and I are pulling our reference.

The section from 915 quoted above? Not ready to tackle that one...yet. :|

W

Keep in mind they are discussing postponing an attack on CoGA theology in this section. My point is that they are NOT entertaining anything that risks the perception of Shan Wei be behind Charis. Faking an archangels visitation when the archangels are returning would do just that.
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