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Tech Levels at the start of next series

This fascinating series is a combination of historical seafaring, swashbuckling adventure, and high technological science-fiction. Join us in a discussion!
Re: Tech Levels at the start of next series
Post by PeterZ   » Sun Jan 21, 2018 9:08 pm

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Erls wrote:Does anyone think Charis could come up with a non-electrical version of the Tank? Basically, a non-electrically started petroleum based vehicle. If they can find a way to manually start the ignition, is this a possibility?


https://peswiki.com/directory:hydrogen-peroxide-as-fuel

Looks like hydrogen peroxide can both oxidize and ignite other fuels without electricity. It strikes me that use in jet engines is more likely because of the require precision in an IC engine. Hydrogen peroxide decomposes if passed through silver mesh. Finding a way to time that exposure sounds tricky, but theoretically possible. Using decomposing HP to ignite fuel in the combustion chamber of a jet engine strikes me as very possible with Safehold tech. Not sure how powerful the jet would be given the tolerances Safehold tech is capable of, but it is possible. Pulse jets are much more likely.

Diesel should be fine for IC reciprocating engines with better power to weight ratios that steam.
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Re: Tech Levels at the start of next series
Post by phillies   » Sun Jan 21, 2018 10:50 pm

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PeterZ wrote:
Erls wrote:Does anyone think Charis could come up with a non-electrical version of the Tank? Basically, a non-electrically started petroleum based vehicle. If they can find a way to manually start the ignition, is this a possibility?


https://peswiki.com/directory:hydrogen-peroxide-as-fuel

Looks like hydrogen peroxide can both oxidize and ignite other fuels without electricity. It strikes me that use in jet engines is more likely because of the require precision in an IC engine. Hydrogen peroxide decomposes if passed through silver mesh. Finding a way to time that exposure sounds tricky, but theoretically possible. Using decomposing HP to ignite fuel in the combustion chamber of a jet engine strikes me as very possible with Safehold tech. Not sure how powerful the jet would be given the tolerances Safehold tech is capable of, but it is possible. Pulse jets are much more likely.

Diesel should be fine for IC reciprocating engines with better power to weight ratios that steam.


The fixation in warfare is in the wrong direction. Economic expansion is the direction. In particular generating the resources to allow the tactical warfare computer to build a set of gadgets that will destroy the Orbital Bombardment System is the correct answer.
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Re: Tech Levels at the start of next series
Post by PeterZ   » Mon Jan 22, 2018 12:09 am

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Jets and diesels have commercial applications as well as military. Between farm equipment, transportation and powered tools of all sorts, these new engine types will expand the economy and develop new skill sets.
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Re: Tech Levels at the start of next series
Post by John Prigent   » Tue Jan 23, 2018 12:53 pm

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I seem to recall that hydrogen peroxide was the stuff used as one component of the fuel in Germany's WW2 rocket fighter the Me 163. Also that pilots had to wear special proofed suits in case of spillage because crashes tended to result in dissolved pilots.
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Re: Tech Levels at the start of next series
Post by Michae   » Wed Jan 24, 2018 12:02 am

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Along those lines,is it possible that we could see some kind of transport aircraft coming out,if the ME262 used hydrogen peroxide as a component of fuel? Because that would revolutionize both the ecomonic and the military aspects to no end.
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Re: Tech Levels at the start of next series
Post by Weird Harold   » Wed Jan 24, 2018 10:12 am

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Michae wrote:Along those lines,is it possible that we could see some kind of transport aircraft coming out,if the ME262 used hydrogen peroxide as a component of fuel? Because that would revolutionize both the ecomonic and the military aspects to no end.


The Me163 used C-Stoff and T-Stoff (H2O2 and Hydrazine, IIRC) The ME262 just used avgas or kerosene. Neither had the endurance required of a transport.

Something like a WWII Glider, lifted to launch altitude by a hot air balloon or blimp, with extended wings for long range soaring, might be the shape of aviation on Safehold.
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Answers! I got lots of answers!

(Now if I could just find the right questions.)
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Re: Tech Levels at the start of next series
Post by Randomiser   » Thu Jan 25, 2018 10:52 am

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Posters seem fascinated by exotic fuels for aircraft, but there is no need. Diesel-engined aircraft flew fine in RL in the 30's and 40's and the technology level would be much less than that for any kind of jet. The JU 86 had twin diesel engines, a range of 980 miles, max speed of 260 mph and bombload of 1000kg. About 900 were built. NO it isn't a superfortress, but it is a whole lot better than nothing. Civilian versions carried 5-10 passengers. There were also a few diesel-engined seaplanes. (For those new to the argument, diesels do not need electricity to either start or run.) Of course aviation diesel engines were dropped and development sidelined because petrol engines were so much lighter, but special circumstances apply on Safehold and none of the required 'research' or development will go to waste. Knowledge of both airframes and diesels will still have lots of uses once electricity becomes available.
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Re: Tech Levels at the start of next series
Post by Randomiser   » Thu Jan 25, 2018 10:55 am

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Erls wrote:Does anyone think Charis could come up with a non-electrical version of the Tank? Basically, a non-electrically started petroleum based vehicle. If they can find a way to manually start the ignition, is this a possibility?


Sure. It's called a diesel engine! Start it with compressed air or a crank.
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Re: Tech Levels at the start of next series
Post by PeterZ   » Thu Jan 25, 2018 1:05 pm

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Part of it is just to keep the R&D minds agile and flexible. I agree diesel will be sufficient for almost any use steam may be more poorly suited for.

Randomiser wrote:Posters seem fascinated by exotic fuels for aircraft, but there is no need. Diesel-engined aircraft flew fine in RL in the 30's and 40's and the technology level would be much less than that for any kind of jet. The JU 86 had twin diesel engines, a range of 980 miles, max speed of 260 mph and bombload of 1000kg. About 900 were built. NO it isn't a superfortress, but it is a whole lot better than nothing. Civilian versions carried 5-10 passengers. There were also a few diesel-engined seaplanes. (For those new to the argument, diesels do not need electricity to either start or run.) Of course aviation diesel engines were dropped and development sidelined because petrol engines were so much lighter, but special circumstances apply on Safehold and none of the required 'research' or development will go to waste. Knowledge of both airframes and diesels will still have lots of uses once electricity becomes available.
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Re: Tech Levels at the start of next series
Post by PeterZ   » Thu Jan 25, 2018 2:06 pm

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I do think that most of the true game changing tech advances in the intervening 20 years will be in chemistry. Those sorts of changes won't be as spectacularly obvious, but their impact will be massive.

Welding with acetylene torches comes to mind. There are hints in the last few books that oil will be important in the Safehold economy. I tend to believe a broad based petrochemical industry that produces a wide variety of chemicals beyond just diesel and other fuels will be developed during the hiatus between story arcs, everything from fertilizer to plastics.
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