Topic Actions

Topic Search

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests

Breaking the Book of Hastings

This fascinating series is a combination of historical seafaring, swashbuckling adventure, and high technological science-fiction. Join us in a discussion!
Re: Breaking the Book of Hastings
Post by Robert_A_Woodward   » Sun Aug 18, 2019 12:01 am

Robert_A_Woodward
Commander

Posts: 230
Joined: Sun Aug 09, 2015 9:29 pm

Peter2 wrote:
Joat42 wrote:
[snip]

I seem to remember that everyone more or less navigated by dead reckoning and experience.


I can't remember any specific references off-hand, but I've got the distinct impression that only Charis's navy sailed the deep seas, certainly before Clyntahn got a bee in his bonnet about that nation's increasing wealth and power. Their galleons were larger and deeper-keeled than other nations', making them much more seaworthy, albeit slightly slower. This implies that the other nations' galleons were coastal vessels, who would use land sightings for navigation as well as their dead reckoning and experience.

Talking of experience, I think I remember reading somewhere that the sailors of Polynesia could navigate with astonishing accuracy by travelling at a given angle to the waves. OK in fine weather of course, while the Pacific is behaving itself . . . :o


There is some mention of navigation by stars by Charis sailors at a time before Nimue's PICA woke up. Certainly, the airships in _Through Fiery Trials_ were using stars to navigate.

I believe that the Polynesians had navigation songs which tied stars to islands.
----------------------------
Beowulf was bad.
(first sentence of Chapter VI of _Space Viking_ by H. Beam Piper)
Top
Re: Breaking the Book of Hastings
Post by Louis R   » Sun Aug 18, 2019 10:37 pm

Louis R
Rear Admiral

Posts: 1150
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 2015 8:25 pm

IIRC, there's a mention that celestial navigation - and the spherical trigonometry to go with it - was one of the skills being inflicted on midshipmen at the new-fangled Naval Academy. One which _experienced_ ship-handlers, such as the Captain and [i think] Admiral witnessing the on-going lessons after deployment had no particular use for or interest in acquiring.

Robert_A_Woodward wrote:
Peter2 wrote:
I can't remember any specific references off-hand, but I've got the distinct impression that only Charis's navy sailed the deep seas, certainly before Clyntahn got a bee in his bonnet about that nation's increasing wealth and power. Their galleons were larger and deeper-keeled than other nations', making them much more seaworthy, albeit slightly slower. This implies that the other nations' galleons were coastal vessels, who would use land sightings for navigation as well as their dead reckoning and experience.

Talking of experience, I think I remember reading somewhere that the sailors of Polynesia could navigate with astonishing accuracy by travelling at a given angle to the waves. OK in fine weather of course, while the Pacific is behaving itself . . . :o


There is some mention of navigation by stars by Charis sailors at a time before Nimue's PICA woke up. Certainly, the airships in _Through Fiery Trials_ were using stars to navigate.

I believe that the Polynesians had navigation songs which tied stars to islands.

Joat42 wrote:
[snip]

I seem to remember that everyone more or less navigated by dead reckoning and experience.
Top
Re: Breaking the Book of Hastings
Post by Louis R   » Sun Aug 18, 2019 11:09 pm

Louis R
Rear Admiral

Posts: 1150
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 2015 8:25 pm

This is, in fact, the _only_ direct observational test that could possibly challenge Hastings, since it's the only phenomenon that can't be explained within the Ptolemaic system. Depending on just how it's cast, it wouldn't be difficult for the Book of Hastings to provide a perfectly good method for predicting a variety of celestial phenomena, and you can be sure that it doesn't present a _derivation_ of that method. There would be no way for the reader to know if the underlying model was Ptolemaic, Keplerian or Einsteinian and no reason for them to wonder about it anyway. Assuming, of course, that there was any need for such predictions.

People are forgetting the reason that accurate measurement and prediction of planetary positions was even a matter of concern in pre-Space Age Europe, and why Brahe's meticulous observations and the construction of the Rudolphine Tables were funded: astrology. If the CoGA has no place for astrology, which is a pretty safe bet on current evidence, nobody is even going to be looking closely enough at the sky to be aware of any discrepancy between what they see going on up there and the explanation provided for it.

Robert_A_Woodward wrote:I suggested mapping the sky to .1" of arc; but I am not certain when that was done on Earth.

However, I just remembered something else. If there are any planets with orbits inside Safehold's, then observations with even a primitive telescope will see that planet in a crescent phase, gibbous phase, or possibly a full phase (though that would be very close to the sun and rather dangerous to observe). This is only possible if that planet is sometimes between the sun and Safehold and sometimes behind the sun (relative to Safehold).
Top

Return to Safehold