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TFT Snippet #9 (fixed to satisfy smart alecs)

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Re: TFT Snippet #9 (fixed to satisfy smart alecs)
Post by Isilith   » Tue Oct 16, 2018 7:07 pm

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cnrd22 wrote:My take on Siddamark is that Charis needs a credible opponent for the second round - I really do not think we'll have Charis against the Temple round 2 and for a while I thought there will be another secret group with knowledge of everything but with their own goals as the main antagonist, but I see no evidence in the snippets for that and similarly I strongly believe the Archangels return is a red herring at least in the immediate future because that would change things too dramatically, so by elimination I believe the author will engineer a reverse of alliances (not unlike what happened after WW2 after all), with Dohlar in and Siddamark out - this obviously won't happen overnight and will take great economic upheaval and at the least the death of Stohnar but the book covers some 15-16 years from the latest info so there is time.

Also Thirsk's family has been mentioned too many times in the books so it's likely it will play an important role and there are lots of kids there for any number of dynastic alliances with Charis as the kids will be growing - something that can and probably would be used by Siddamark enemies of Charis to show Charisian perfidy in betraying their war allies and siding with their enemies etc


Yeah, pretty sure the snippets show a 5 year gap, not a 15 year gap.
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Re: TFT Snippet #9 (fixed to satisfy smart alecs)
Post by cnrd22   » Wed Oct 17, 2018 8:02 am

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Isilith wrote:Yeah, pretty sure the snippets show a 5 year gap, not a 15 year gap.


The book takes place over 15-16 years - afaik it ends in March 916, so the curent snippets are just early timewise too
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Re: TFT Snippet #9 (fixed to satisfy smart alecs)
Post by Isilith   » Wed Oct 17, 2018 4:05 pm

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cnrd22 wrote:
Isilith wrote:Yeah, pretty sure the snippets show a 5 year gap, not a 15 year gap.


The book takes place over 15-16 years - afaik it ends in March 916, so the curent snippets are just early timewise too


Umm, what? The snippets start in 899-900... and do not cover a 15-16 year gap past that. Nor has he jumped ahead years INSIDE any of his previous Safehold books.

Also, unless you have access to read the book early, which you might have for all I know, all we have to go on are the snippets, and they do not cover anywhere near that length of time.
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Re: TFT Snippet #9 (fixed to satisfy smart alecs)
Post by Randomiser   » Wed Oct 17, 2018 4:54 pm

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Isilith wrote:Umm, what? The snippets start in 899-900... and do not cover a 15-16 year gap past that. Nor has he jumped ahead years INSIDE any of his previous Safehold books.

Also, unless you have access to read the book early, which you might have for all I know, all we have to go on are the snippets, and they do not cover anywhere near that length of time.


I can't find the quote but I'm pretty sure RFC said somewhere that this book would bring us forward by about 15 or 16 years. Anyone else able to supply the need? To that end I am expecting episodes every so often rather than a connected month to month narrative and we have seen something of that starting in the snippets.
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Re: TFT Snippet #9 (fixed to satisfy smart alecs)
Post by dobriennm   » Wed Oct 17, 2018 7:31 pm

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Randomiser wrote:
Isilith wrote:Umm, what? The snippets start in 899-900... and do not cover a 15-16 year gap past that. Nor has he jumped ahead years INSIDE any of his previous Safehold books.

Also, unless you have access to read the book early, which you might have for all I know, all we have to go on are the snippets, and they do not cover anywhere near that length of time.


I can't find the quote but I'm pretty sure RFC said somewhere that this book would bring us forward by about 15 or 16 years. Anyone else able to supply the need? To that end I am expecting episodes every so often rather than a connected month to month narrative and we have seen something of that starting in the snippets.


Based on what the Author has said in the Fall of 2015, it will be a 20 year jump. There have been other talks since then which have held to a 20 year or so jump.

However, the author will somehow cover important events and societal/political developments over that 20 years.

After all, what the author is really trying to do is "set the scene" for the start of Arc 2. From the readers standpoint, don't we want to get into the main action as fast as possible? Also, as the author has mentioned before, the books have already become "door stoppers". How much bigger do we really want them to be?

The 20 year jump is based on David Weber's 2015 National Book Festival talk right after Like a Mighty Army came out.

David Weber's 2015 National Book Festival Talk

It talks a lot about the Honor Harrington series, but also mentions the Safehold series, in particular, how there is one more book after HFQ to complete the present story arc. It also mentions that after the 20 year "gap" to the next Safehold story arc, everyone will have steam powered economies with the implication that the fight will be harder/bloodier[MY interpretation].
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Re: TFT Snippet #9 (fixed to satisfy smart alecs)
Post by Weird Harold   » Wed Oct 17, 2018 8:23 pm

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dobriennm wrote:Based on what the Author has said in the Fall of 2015, it will be a 20 year jump. There have been other talks since then which have held to a 20 year or so jump.


I'm pretty sure that has been superseded by RFC's comment about needing a complete revision to avoid telling most of the story in flashbacks. He did NOT specify the Safehold book as the one that required a different approach, but none of the other current projects matches the description.
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Re: TFT Snippet #9 (fixed to satisfy smart alecs)
Post by Isilith   » Wed Oct 17, 2018 10:45 pm

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Weird Harold wrote:
dobriennm wrote:Based on what the Author has said in the Fall of 2015, it will be a 20 year jump. There have been other talks since then which have held to a 20 year or so jump.


I'm pretty sure that has been superseded by RFC's comment about needing a complete revision to avoid telling most of the story in flashbacks. He did NOT specify the Safehold book as the one that required a different approach, but none of the other current projects matches the description.



Yuppers, and buried somewhere on here was his latest "how many books will it take and in which arcs" discussion. The celery chaser has added a lot of story to Safehold, which is fine by me.
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Re: TFT Snippet #9 (fixed to satisfy smart alecs)
Post by Louis R   » Wed Oct 17, 2018 10:56 pm

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Assuming I understood the comments correctly, the intent is that we will still have moved forward 15-20 years by the end of the book. The rewrite was to convert a huge set of flashbacks into current-time narrative, as there is a great deal we need to learn _somehow_ about the intervening period, and he decided he might as well just tell us the story.

Of course, with Himself the road to the bookstore is paved with good intentions. I'll not be the least bit surprised if TFT in fact end where it was supposed to start - with that pesky Lost Testament.


dobriennm wrote:Based on what the Author has said in the Fall of 2015, it will be a 20 year jump. There have been other talks since then which have held to a 20 year or so jump.

Isilith wrote:
Weird Harold wrote:I'm pretty sure that has been superseded by RFC's comment about needing a complete revision to avoid telling most of the story in flashbacks. He did NOT specify the Safehold book as the one that required a different approach, but none of the other current projects matches the description.



Yuppers, and buried somewhere on here was his latest "how many books will it take and in which arcs" discussion. The celery chaser has added a lot of story to Safehold, which is fine by me.
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Re: TFT Snippet #9 (fixed to satisfy smart alecs)
Post by dobriennm   » Wed Oct 17, 2018 10:59 pm

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Weird Harold wrote:
dobriennm wrote:Based on what the Author has said in the Fall of 2015, it will be a 20 year jump. There have been other talks since then which have held to a 20 year or so jump.


I'm pretty sure that has been superseded by RFC's comment about needing a complete revision to avoid telling most of the story in flashbacks. He did NOT specify the Safehold book as the one that required a different approach, but none of the other current projects matches the description.



Isilith wrote:Yuppers, and buried somewhere on here was his latest "how many books will it take and in which arcs" discussion. The celery chaser has added a lot of story to Safehold, which is fine by me.


So I'm guessing the original plan for this first book in the new story arc, starting 20 years after At the Sign of Triumph, was to give the backstory (the story of what happened in the 20 year gap) via a series of flashbacks.


But apparently the Author found that didn't work (too complicated? broke the flow of the story too many times?).


So now I'm guessing the plan is to rewrite the flashbacks as a series of short scenes of the highpoints/important developments-decisions that jump through the 20 years and arrive back at the same starting point for the real story the Author intended for this book.

Still think we're jumping ahead 20 years.
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Re: TFT Snippet #9 (fixed to satisfy smart alecs)
Post by cnrd22   » Thu Oct 18, 2018 5:49 am

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dobriennm wrote:
Still think we're jumping ahead 20 years.


As noted above - from people who were lucky to actually read the advance reader copy Tor has provided - I heard a few things that I think will prove accurate - the book ends in March 916 (as the first Archangel return date is summer 915, the book has to take us past it), there are a lot of weddings, funerals and economic turmoil, but not much war and the snippet like structure following a few threads across years holds until the end
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