Somtaaw wrote:Gravitonics are going to be effective, because they're hyper missiles. And SW ships (and Death Stars) are just so damned slow (even the snubfighters) Dahak could pick them off with missiles that flick into hyper and come back down inside the shields that should be protecting them.
Sorry but nope. That idea already exists in the SW-verse and has been delegated to the big pile of "obsolete". Standard SW shields protect against it, impossible to hyperspace through them.
Somtaaw wrote:Now to be fair, we don't know 100% that Star Wars shields DON'T cover a tiny bit into hyper.
Actually the opposite has already been stated, that hypering through shields is NOT possible.
Somtaaw wrote: If they're close enough to use sublight, they're using atomic-shattering energy weapons
Which ends up mostly dissipating against the SW particleshielding.
Somtaaw wrote:Yes, I do consider that a draw, because Suncrusher (solo) cannot inflict enough damage on Dahak
Inflict damage is easy. Hitting might not be.
Somtaaw wrote:A bit incorrect actually. Look how Kyp Durron actually used them, he only ever fired them into planets, because it does something that messes with the solar fission, and induces supernova....
I haven´t read the story at all, but i HAVE read the techspecs and explanations for it.
Sorry no, not incorrect. Just because he doesn´t feel ships is worthy enough for his limited supply of 11(?) torpedoes, says absolutely nothing about their effect on other things.
Somtaaw wrote:which is more or less what a properly aimed gravitonic missile can induce (the super gravitonic that was the main plot of the third plot).
Except resonance torpedoes are NOT stated to be gravitonic warheads but something much MUCH nastier.
Upon detonation, all matter in contact with the warhead is dissolved
and becomes fuel for the nuclear fission AND fusion reaction initiated.
So no, definitely not gravitonic. And it´s stated (somewhere at least) that anything smaller than a star is automatic instakill.Upon detonation, a resonance torpedo dissolved metals and expanded into a massive explosion. The explosion then destabilized the fusion reactions of a star, causing it to supernova. This massive explosion would cause any nearby stars or objects of matter to explode as well, causing a chain reaction powerful enough to destroy a whole star system.
Somtaaw wrote:And the gravitonics can also be fired elsewhere, while the Suncrusher's resonance torpedoes seemingly cannot. I don't recall if it's mentioned in the books themselves, but from every fight, it never once fired a resonance torpedo anywhere except into a Sun. Not once.
Again, if you have 11 weapons with no refills EVER again, are you going to use them against individual targets or against whole star systems?
I´m using official tech statements for them, not the fiction they´re taken from.
Somtaaw wrote:Which I allowed for, it's possible that due to the metals used in producing Dahak, in combination with his kilometers of armor (also of a generally higher grade than that found on ISD's, Mon Cal cruisers, or the Death Star itself), while a planet has none of the above. And planetoids are remarkably durable, with their internal blastdoors sealing kilometer deep holes. There's more chance of an Imperium planetoid surviving a direct blast from the DS, and a planet has 0% chance. Even if it's only one percent, one percent being higher than zero percent, planetoid has higher potential survivability against the superlaser.
No, just NO.
Seriously man, the DS superlaser doesn´t care even the slightest about normal armour, normal armour is 100% useless against it. The superlaser pumps in enough energy for it to make a PLANET that is at least 10 times the MASS of a Dahak to completely explode from energy overload, a cause of damage that any kind of normal armour propagates rather than blocks.
That´s why i said that armour made specially to protect against the DS superlaser MIGHT help, but nothing else.
You need a combination of extremely spaced out, NON-energy conductive materials and INSANE depth to even have a real chance.
Instead of many many km of armour, you would probably need to have half the radius of a Dahak with nothing but armour, compression/damage zones and insulation zones before you might have a tiny little chance of surival for it.
And even then, i don´t give it more than a "icecube in hell" level of chance.
A superlaser that can deliver that much energy in such a short time, the end results from having 10km or 200km of armour isn´t even going to be noticeable without laboratory examination.
Please, do remember that metal conducts energy much better than soil, magma or mountains.
Somtaaw wrote:Must differ here, as I said above. The Resonance torpedo was exclusively targeted on suns, and actually only on stars of a certain size to trigger a proper supernova.
Resonance Torpedo no where on the weapon page itself, or in the books, ever suggested it could be fired against planetary targets. After being fired, it's literally nothing more than superheated plasma
Do read better. Absolutely nowhere does it say that the weapon has anything to do with plasma.
The only thing said is that when fired, each torpedoe RESEMBLED an oval of superheated plasma. Which says nothing of what it is.
And you might want to note that my above quote is from the page you link. There are better/more complete sources, but not online.
And if you had actually bothered to READ the link you provide yourself, you might have noted that it was ALSO fired at a NEBULA to allow causing MULTIPLE stars to supernova.
But that doesn´t really matter as in the tech stuff on them, it is stated that they ARE instakill against anything they hit. They´re just not superspeed or super accuracy weapons because their PRIMARY job is to hit big and essentially nonmoving objects.
That´s NOT the same as not being able to be used directly against smaller targets.
Somtaaw wrote:If the books hold, then it did have standard starfighter level shields. Call it slightly more powerful than an X-wing's shields, perhaps somewhere closer to those of the later TIE Defender's or K-wings, both of which were larger than most other fighters, although still smaller than the Suncrusher. With all the ships that were firing at it, during the Maw Installation escape, it's shields dropped fairly quickly, and it's minor turrets were quickly destroyed. But the idiot-proof armor allowed it to keep flying, and ram right through the (unarmored) ISD bridge.
In that case, then any of Dahaks "usual" weaponry is pretty much only useful as long as it can keep those shields to exactly zero.
Which is ridiculously hard when you can´t actually drop the shields with the same weapons that might be able to get past the superarmour.
Like i said before, the Sun Crusher is a hideously overpowered piece of author fiat plot device. And unlike most "normal" stuff form the SW-verse, it has absolutely no good or even remotely realistic reasoning behind its tech.
Somtaaw wrote:Gravitonics are going to be effective, because they're hyper missiles.
Which SW shields stop dead yes, so NO.
And it should perhaps be mentioned again that the SW-verse DOES have gravitonic warheads and weaponry, it just isn´t used except by "primitives" or those who can´t get anything "decent".
Because it doesn´t work against average or normal opponents.
Somtaaw wrote:SW ships don't defend at all against anything from hyper
That´s because their shields already do it so they don´t need to.
Somtaaw wrote:and a gravitonic being what amounts to a micro-blackhole
That´s overly simplified. A micro-blackhole wouldn´t even be dangerous. Or a BLACK hole for that matter.
Somtaaw wrote:would crumple just about any ship smaller than capital ships with just one missile.
Ah no. That´s Hollywood physics striking again. And RFC also doesn´t have his gravitonic weapons work that unrealistically.
Somtaaw wrote:And he could do the same to snubfighters, because he was picking off Imperial fighters during the Siege of Anu's Base, from orbit, and killed all of them before they could send a transmission.
A Dahak planetoid could do it against unshielded TIE-fighters yes, anything with shields, sorry but not a chance.
That´s the thing, SW-verse ships doesn´t need to defend against missiles, hypermissiles, antimatter, particle-disintegrators and a lot of other various stuff, because their combination of shields(mainly particle shields and deflector shields) do that perfectly fine.
Some rare fighters doesn´t have particle shields, like the TIE Defender, and would be vulnerable to antimatter and some other weapon types, but mostly, SW-verse weaponry is about delivering craploads of raw firepower, enough to hopefully penetrate the shielding and start hurting the ship, or at least indirectly hurt the shield generators to eventually kill the shielding completely.
But this is where it turns ugly for the Dahaks, all their weapons are mostly neutralised by those shields, and the heavyhitters pretty much completely, which means Dahak´s can hit a DS super easily, but doing damage is going to take a LOOOONG time.
While a DS is going to have one hell of a time scoring hits on a Dahak, but IF it hits, the stupidly high raw firepower is going to hurt it badly pretty damn quick.
And of course, if a Dahak is ever foolish enough to let a DS get a hit with supergun, it´s game over, bye-bye.
Like i said, the two are really REALLY dreadful opponents to put in a fight, utterly unsuitable to fight each other.
The Dahak would probably be better off using LESS advanced weapons to tear through DS shields with, while a DS needs to use all the tricks possible to score damage on a Dahak.