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Early Crank Operated Machine Guns.

Alternate history buff? Wander on over for a discussion about Eric Flint's 1632 series!
Early Crank Operated Machine Guns.
Post by pokermind   » Mon Nov 21, 2011 8:53 pm

pokermind
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Posts: 2307
Joined: Tue Oct 25, 2011 8:58 am
Location: Idaho

Early crank operated Machine guns.

1) The Gardner although the least produced was probably the best. This Illustration shows its operation:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v-x7B-pj3_o

The Gardner influenced the first fully automatic Machine gun the Maxim that's operation is illustrated below:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P1SbcZQ0N5A

2) The Gatling Gun is much more complex three times the firing mechanisms as the Gardner and cylindrical curves to machine. The following shows the operation of the Gatling gun:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZoMe8hV6uFM

There is something on the multirace[?sp.] firing, but my spelling handicap prevented me from finding again on You Tube. Perhaps some helpful Harold out there might help. But just looking at it it is a heavy awkward gun, although simple to machine. Note the USE navy already uses them on both iron-cads and timber-cads

My most prolific gunsmith buddy has made a Gardner and a Gatling, he curses making a Gatling due to the difficulty of machining the slots inside a cylinder to operate the mechanism. The Gardner is a simple to machine cam system.

Image

To look at the above slide show right click on the word Image above, then left click on view image, Takes two clicks on return key at the top of the screen to get back.

Slide show shows me in buckskins, two guns one I made ins shop class, the Flintlock Revolver. and one I made with the gunsmith buddy mentioned above a copy of a German 1598 Hand Mortar the original is in the Tower of London collection. The small female pussy cat is my cat Kitten who is fifteen-years-old now. The Helm in the charcoal drawing of me holding the Hand Mortar is Hessuite[?sp.]
CPO Poker Mind Image SOB = Squid On Beach and, Mangy Fur the Smart Alick Spacecat First. Note both are fictional characters I was never in the USN.
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Re: Early Crank Operated Machine Guns.
Post by pokermind   » Mon Dec 05, 2011 5:44 pm

pokermind
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 2307
Joined: Tue Oct 25, 2011 8:58 am
Location: Idaho

pokermind wrote:Early crank operated Machine guns.

1) The Gardner although the least produced was probably the best. This Illustration shows its operation:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v-x7B-pj3_o

The Gardner influenced the first fully automatic Machine gun the Maxim that's operation is illustrated below:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P1SbcZQ0N5A

2) The Gatling Gun is much more complex three times the firing mechanisms as the
Gardner and cylindrical curves to machine.
The following shows the operation of the Gatling gun:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZoMe8hV6uFM

There is something on the multirace[?sp.] firing, but my spelling handicap prevented me from finding again on You Tube. Perhaps some helpful
Harold out there might help. But just looking at it it is a heavy awkward gun, although simple to machine.
Note the USE navy already uses them on both iron-cads and timber-cads

My most prolific gunsmith buddy has made a Gardner and a Gatling, he curses making a
Gatling due to the difficulty of machining the slots inside a cylinder to operate the mechanism.
The Gardner is a simple to machine cam system.

Image

To look at the above slide show right click on the word Image above, then left click on view image,
Takes two clicks on return key at the top of the screen to get back.

Slide show shows me in buckskins, two guns one I made ins shop class, the Flintlock Revolver. and one
I made with the gunsmith buddy mentioned above a copy of a German 1598 Hand Mortar the original is in the
Tower of London collection. The small female pussy cat is my cat Kitten who is fifteen-years-old now.
The Helm in the charcoal drawing of me holding the Hand Mortar is Hessuite[?sp.]


Finally figured how to put photos on posts:

Image

My cat 'Kitten' age 15 with two firearms

Image

Flintlock Revolver I built in Engineering shop class and match/wheel-lock Hand mortar a friend and
I made, he owns a machine shop.

Image

Close up of match/wheel-lock on hand mortar this lock has 58 parts with 8 springs four inside four outside.
The straight cock is for a match, the serpentine down is the wheel lock, note the welding sparkier in the jaws.

Image

Myself watercolor 1982 Massacre Rocks Rendezvous, Holding the Beast 'K' gauge = 1.5 inch blunderbuss
brass barrel cast in 1751 Birmingham England Lock of French musket 1777 and furniture
French 1774, built in 1780 may have fought in revolution.

Image

Myself charcoal portrait 2003 that's the muzzle of the 212.5 caliber hand mortar.

Image

A breach-loading Hall 1833 percussion carbine made by a friend, and a
English style matchlock ca 1600 made my a friend and me.
Last edited by pokermind on Tue Jul 17, 2012 8:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
CPO Poker Mind Image SOB = Squid On Beach and, Mangy Fur the Smart Alick Spacecat First. Note both are fictional characters I was never in the USN.
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Re: Early Crank Operated Machine Guns.
Post by pokermind   » Sat Dec 31, 2011 4:02 pm

pokermind
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 2307
Joined: Tue Oct 25, 2011 8:58 am
Location: Idaho

I wrote this in Cartridge Guns but will work here too. Dr Gatling invented his famous multi-barreled hand cranked machine gun in 1862. Oddly enough it did not use a drawn brass cartridge such as discussed above, but a machined iron cartridge that could be reloaded by soldiers in the field using standard rifled-musket cartridge, and musket caps. This is the original Patent Drawing for his gun:

Image

As I could not find a contemporary drawing of the iron cartridge I drew a section drawing for you:

Image

My gunsmithing buddy Elmer has a Gatling that uses these cartridges. They are an easy straight forward machining job, a couple of screwmachines could be set up to make them in quantity, and might be a stop-gap for Grantville, and the USE Army.
Last edited by pokermind on Tue Jul 17, 2012 8:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.
CPO Poker Mind Image SOB = Squid On Beach and, Mangy Fur the Smart Alick Spacecat First. Note both are fictional characters I was never in the USN.
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Re: Early Crank Operated Machine Guns.
Post by pokermind   » Sat Feb 18, 2012 5:32 pm

pokermind
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 2307
Joined: Tue Oct 25, 2011 8:58 am
Location: Idaho

Early crank operated Machine guns.

1) The Gardner although the least produced was probably the best. This Illustration shows its operation:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v-x7B-pj3_o

The Gardner influenced the first fully automatic Machine gun the Maxim that's operation is illustrated below:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P1SbcZQ0N5A

2) The Gatling Gun is much more complex three times the firing mechanisms as the Gardner and cylindrical curves to machine. The following shows the operation of the Gatling gun:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZoMe8hV6uFM

The Reffy Mitrailleuse 1867:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jO3haWrRtrY&feature=related

Note the USE navy already uses them on both iron-cads and timber-cads

My most prolific gunsmith buddy has made a Gardner and a Gatling, he curses making a Gatling due to the difficulty of machining the slots inside a cylinder to operate the mechanism. The Gardner is a simple to machine cam system.

Poker
CPO Poker Mind Image SOB = Squid On Beach and, Mangy Fur the Smart Alick Spacecat First. Note both are fictional characters I was never in the USN.
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Re: Early Crank Operated Machine Guns.
Post by robert132   » Mon Jun 25, 2012 1:34 pm

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Posts: 234
Joined: Thu Apr 07, 2011 8:20 pm

Thanks for the look at this gun tech Poker. To be honest if any of us had tried to produce any kind of firearm in high school shop class the teacher would either have had a fit or called the sheriff ... or both, him being a city boy transplanted into a rural community in the late 1960's (dating myself here a bit.)

I've just been introduced to the 1632 Series so I'm more than a little curious about what is in store for the good people of Grantville.

Thanks again shipmate. (I know, I know ... you were never in the Navy. But I was and I know EXACTLY what "shipmate" means in all its forms. I think it appropriate here friend I never met.)
****

Just my opinion of course and probably not worth the paper it's not written on.
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Re: Early Crank Operated Machine Guns.
Post by pokermind   » Tue Jul 17, 2012 8:58 pm

pokermind
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 2307
Joined: Tue Oct 25, 2011 8:58 am
Location: Idaho

Hi all,

An author on Baen's Bar, John F, has shared a site with more information and types of early rapid fire guns I give the home site pick the weapon you wish to research from the list:

http://www.victorianshipmodels.com/antitorpedoboatguns/index.html

John's favorite is the Hotchkiss 37 MM automatic cannon:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GkOP8Lwdmgg

Enjoy

Poker
CPO Poker Mind Image SOB = Squid On Beach and, Mangy Fur the Smart Alick Spacecat First. Note both are fictional characters I was never in the USN.
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Re: Early Crank Operated Machine Guns.
Post by alphapatch   » Thu Aug 23, 2012 9:51 pm

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Lieutenant (Junior Grade)

Posts: 38
Joined: Sun Dec 11, 2011 9:24 pm

I believe the gun you couldn't relocate was the Montigny Mitralleuse.
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Re: Early Crank Operated Machine Guns.
Post by pokermind   » Sat Oct 06, 2012 2:01 am

pokermind
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 2307
Joined: Tue Oct 25, 2011 8:58 am
Location: Idaho

alphapatch wrote:I believe the gun you couldn't relocate was the Montigny Mitralleuse.


Oh, you mean this one:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=497Htfzz1nc&list=UUFOZwUakpRbIH2zisiRU0Dw&index=6&feature=plcp

Poker
CPO Poker Mind Image SOB = Squid On Beach and, Mangy Fur the Smart Alick Spacecat First. Note both are fictional characters I was never in the USN.
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Re: Early Crank Operated Machine Guns.
Post by madison11   » Thu Feb 07, 2013 7:53 am

madison11
Midshipman

Posts: 1
Joined: Thu Feb 07, 2013 7:47 am

Love to see the machine gun here, hope I could have in my own.
I wanna bring this all the time “blowguns “
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Re: Early Crank Operated Machine Guns.
Post by Thucydides   » Mon Feb 25, 2013 2:43 am

Thucydides
Commander

Posts: 114
Joined: Mon Feb 25, 2013 2:15 am

Surprised no one mentioned the Nordenfelt Gun, which is relatively simple and robust, although much larger and heavier than most of the other early hand powered automatic weapons when expanded to 12 barrels.

This gun was used by the British in Africa quite extensively, usually 1" 2 or 4 barrel weapons developed for the Royal Navy as quick firing guns to repel torpedo boats but now mounted on mobile carriages for land use. Since these are closer to automatic cannons or artillery than "machine guns", they might be a bit out of place, but rifle calibre versions also existed, and while they had up to 12 barrels, there is no reason smaller lighter weapons with 4 or 5 barrels could not have been developed as mobile support weapons.
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