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What has Pres. Trump done wrong so far.

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Re: What has Pres. Trump done wrong so far.
Post by Dilandu   » Fri Nov 02, 2018 4:24 pm

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Imaginos1892 wrote:
Dilandu wrote:To be precise, he directed them to shoot back if they would be attacked by stones & other things.

A rock is a deadly weapon. A 'protest sign' on a long, thick pole is a deadly weapon. A burning bottle of gasoline is EMPHATICALLY a deadly weapon. If a mob starts using such weapons against police, or soldiers, they sure as HELL should shoot back. After the first rock is thrown.

Try to target the instigators, but do whatever it takes to keep the mob from overrunning the police. At that point, it's self-defense.

If the instigators are caught, prosecute them for EVERY injury and death, including those among the 'protesters'.
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Re: What has Pres. Trump done wrong so far.
Post by gcomeau   » Fri Nov 02, 2018 4:42 pm

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Dilandu wrote:
gcomeau wrote:The president of the United States just publicly directed the US military to shoot unarmed civilians.

(No, having a rock does not make you "armed" under any US military rule of engagement that had existed before)


To be precise, he directed them to shoot back if they would be attacked by stones & other things.


Which, to be precise, would be a crime.

US military rules of engagement absolutely DO NOT authorize use of deadly force against civilians throwing freaking rocks. For mind numbingly obvious reasons.
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Re: What has Pres. Trump done wrong so far.
Post by Imaginos1892   » Fri Nov 02, 2018 5:20 pm

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gcomeau wrote:US military rules of engagement absolutely DO NOT authorize use of deadly force against civilians throwing freaking rocks. For mind numbingly obvious reasons.

That is an abysmally stupid rule, that encourages rioting mobs to throw rocks at our soldiers. Tell you what, go stand against a wall while a mob of rioting assholes throw rocks at you, and see if you are still opposed to fighting back.

If you survive.
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Re: What has Pres. Trump done wrong so far.
Post by gcomeau   » Fri Nov 02, 2018 5:25 pm

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Imaginos1892 wrote:
gcomeau wrote:US military rules of engagement absolutely DO NOT authorize use of deadly force against civilians throwing freaking rocks. For mind numbingly obvious reasons.

That is an abysmally stupid rule, that encourages rioting mobs to throw rocks at our soldiers. Tell you what, go stand against a wall while a mob of rioting assholes throw rocks at you, and see if you are still opposed to fighting back.

If you survive.
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It takes two to make peace. It only takes one to make war.


Tell you what, find me a several thousand strong unit of armed to the fucking teeth professional soldiers that is the equivalent of some guy "standing against a wall" while unarmed civilians throw rocks at them first.

Because while some rock throwers may be a threat to the guy at the wall, they are ZERO threat to the US freaking military. And using deadly force against civilians who pose no threat to you is a bad thing. Try to wrap your mind around that.
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Re: What has Pres. Trump done wrong so far.
Post by Imaginos1892   » Fri Nov 02, 2018 5:40 pm

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gcomeau wrote:Tell you what, find me a several thousand strong unit of armed to the fucking teeth professional soldiers that is the equivalent of some guy "standing against a wall" while unarmed civilians throw rocks at them first.

They don't throw rocks at several-thousand-strong military units, though. They surround a small squad of half a dozen soldiers and throw hundreds of rocks at them. Try to wrap your mind around something other than your own preconception that the US is always wrong.
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Re: What has Pres. Trump done wrong so far.
Post by gcomeau   » Fri Nov 02, 2018 6:20 pm

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Imaginos1892 wrote:
gcomeau wrote:Tell you what, find me a several thousand strong unit of armed to the fucking teeth professional soldiers that is the equivalent of some guy "standing against a wall" while unarmed civilians throw rocks at them first.

They don't throw rocks at several-thousand-strong military units, though. They surround a small squad of half a dozen soldiers and throw hundreds of rocks at them. Try to wrap your mind around something other than your own preconception that the US is always wrong.


If you had been paying attention you would have seen that I said US military rules of engagement were right.

Trump the fucking moron is wrong.

There's a difference between "Trump" and "the US". Quite a large one.

And if you think thousands of migrants are going to show up as an army at the border (they aren't) and they're going to be an angry rioting violent mob (they aren't) and that in response to that mob the US military would deploy a 6 man squad across the border into the middle of them for some bizarre reason... it must be fascinating to live in your brain.
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Re: What has Pres. Trump done wrong so far.
Post by Imaginos1892   » Fri Nov 02, 2018 6:42 pm

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I am simply disproving your idiotic claim that it is always wrong for soldiers to shoot back at 'civilians' throwing rocks. All the rest of your rant is in your head, not mine.
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Re: What has Pres. Trump done wrong so far.
Post by Joat42   » Fri Nov 02, 2018 6:51 pm

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Imaginos1892 wrote:
gcomeau wrote:Tell you what, find me a several thousand strong unit of armed to the fucking teeth professional soldiers that is the equivalent of some guy "standing against a wall" while unarmed civilians throw rocks at them first.

They don't throw rocks at several-thousand-strong military units, though. They surround a small squad of half a dozen soldiers and throw hundreds of rocks at them. Try to wrap your mind around something other than your own preconception that the US is always wrong.
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I used to live on a farm. I know what bullshit smells like.

He didn't say that the US was wrong, just you.

And funnily enough, there's a lot of veterans out there that has the exact same view of the situation as gcomeau. Are you going to say that they also have preconceptions that the US is always wrong?

Further, calling the ROE in the USMCJ for stupid only confirms that you have no actual clue why it exists.

Here's the thing: You bought the Trump cool-aid, all you can think of is "the invasion of illegal immigrants" or any other rhetoric Trump spewed. It's a typical 'wag the dog' tactic and you are the dog and you are getting wagged all over the place.

If you manage to engage you brain and think critically for a moment, think about what Trump doesn't want you to think or talk about. Let me help you along:

  • Voter suppression, just look at the shenanigans Brian Kemp is up to.
  • That Trump said that the pipe bomber helped stopping the Democratic momentum.
  • That Trump said that the synagogue shooting helped stopping the Democratic momentum.
  • That both events above was triggered by Trumps rhetoric.
  • That 4 white supremacists was indicted for inciting violence at California political rallies (from the same group that incited the riot in Charlottesville).
  • The debt is increasing rapidly
  • The stock market is taking a hammering
  • Sucking up to Saudi Arabia
  • The Mueller investigation

---
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Re: What has Pres. Trump done wrong so far.
Post by Imaginos1892   » Fri Nov 02, 2018 7:06 pm

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So, you want the squad to stand there with their thumbs up their asses and be murdered by a rock-throwing mob?
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Re: What has Pres. Trump done wrong so far.
Post by Joat42   » Fri Nov 02, 2018 7:33 pm

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Imaginos1892 wrote:So, you want the squad to stand there with their thumbs up their asses and be murdered by a rock-throwing mob?

So... Trump says that if someone throws a rock at the military they can shoot them. From that you have through your faulty reasoning come to the conclusion that the military will be overrun by an angry, rock throwing mob of illegal immigrants. :roll:

You are so spoon fed lies and misconceptions you can't be bothered to find out what really is happening.

Here's a little hint:
Earlier in the day, before Trump’s incendiary comments about rocks and rifles, retired Rear Adm. John Kirby said the fact is the troops who will be supporting civilian Customs and Border Protection personnel won't be interacting directly with migrants. “Trump is not being honest with the American people about what these troops are going to be doing,” said Kirby on CNN, where he is now a paid contributor. “When he talks about them, he creates this word picture for people that these troops are going to be hurling back invaders at the border, side-by-side with the border patrol. That's just not the case. In fact, many of them will never even get close to the border. They're supply people, medical support. They're going to be building tents and temporary housing facilities. They're going to be freeing up the border patrol to do their job a little more. They're not allowed to get into law enforcement issues.

---
Jack of all trades and destructive tinkerer.


Anyone who have simple solutions for complex problems is a fool.
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