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Ukraine

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Re: Ukraine
Post by smr   » Tue Nov 18, 2014 10:03 am

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The Swedish leaders already received their fair share...remember the peons get nothing!
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Re: Ukraine
Post by Tenshinai   » Wed Nov 19, 2014 3:29 pm

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smr wrote:The Swedish leaders already received their fair share...remember the peons get nothing!


Uh yeah... Or not? Swedish government was voted out...
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Re: Ukraine
Post by smr   » Mon Nov 24, 2014 5:31 am

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Why did the Swedish navy not detect the Russian sub that was in it's waters? The Europeans and the US heard a radio message in Russian asking for help from the Russians! (I am assuming that it was in code!) The Russians have not forgotten about Swedes! Better start updating the good old language skills for Russian! Remember their your friends! I know it's the dastardly Americans fault! :lol:


Tenshinai wrote:
smr wrote:The Swedish leaders already received their fair share...remember the peons get nothing!


Uh yeah... Or not? Swedish government was voted out...
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Re: Ukraine
Post by Tenshinai   » Mon Nov 24, 2014 2:14 pm

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smr wrote: The Europeans and the US heard a radio message in Russian asking for help from the Russians! (I am assuming that it was in code!)


Except that didn´t happen. I have enough connections to verify that and there was no such thing. That´s just your media being stupid. Even regular media here has aknowledged that it was a false claim.

FRA is quite competent, and they do not miss a radio broadcast almost in shouting distance from where they have radio tracking and detection gear.

smr wrote:Why did the Swedish navy not detect the Russian sub that was in it's waters?


Why do you think it was Russian, if there was one?

And well, think about this, USN is utterly incapable of tracking Swedish Gotland class subs if they don´t want to be tracked.

Swedish military itself trains on a regular basis against the Gotland class and have at least some ability to track them.

...

smr wrote:The Russians have not forgotten about Swedes! Better start updating the good old language skills for Russian! Remember their your friends! I know it's the dastardly Americans fault!


No they most definitely have not forgotten, even if extreme defeats like the battle of Narva tends to be wished to be forgotten.

Sweden and Finland are pretty much the only ones that have really trashed Russia militarily (causing bigtime defeats while at major disadvantage).

And Russia has already quit trying to be an empire, unlike USA which seems to be aiming for making a showcase of what "crash and burn" means. And empires trying to avoid falling apart are potentially far more dangerous than empires that break up from internal sentiments.

I feel no reason to fear Russia as such in the foreseeable future. What is dangerous is if EU/USA/NATO keeps causing provocations against Russia.

In 1993, Russia was given the guarantee that there would be no NATO expansion eastwards.
Well, guess that´s one more broken promise, to add to the many previous. Combined with how many big invasions have come from the west, anyone being surprised that Russia is wary is an idiot.
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Re: Ukraine
Post by Taras_Potatos   » Mon Nov 24, 2014 4:52 pm

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And Russia has already quit trying to be an empire, unlike USA which seems to be aiming for making a showcase of what "crash and burn" means. And empires trying to avoid falling apart are potentially far more dangerous than empires that break up from internal sentiments.


You make my day, you know? :lol:

In 1993, Russia was given the guarantee that there would be no NATO expansion eastwards.
Well, guess that´s one more broken promise, to add to the many previous. Combined with how many big invasions have come from the west, anyone being surprised that Russia is wary is an idiot.


And Gorby (M. Gorbachev) said that there was no such promise. ;)
http://www.zdf.de/ZDFmediathek/beitrag/video/2273826/Der-traurige-Held-der-Perestroika#/beitrag/video/2273826/Der-traurige-Held-der-Perestroika

UPD.

President of Ukraine Poroshenko said that Ukraine re-establishes the course for Euro-Atlantic integration. His statement, voiced by advisor to Ukrainian President Rostislav Pavlenko today at the 60th session of the Assembly in The Hague, was addressed to members of the NATO Parliamentary Assembly
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Re: Ukraine
Post by Bruno Behrends   » Tue Nov 25, 2014 3:24 am

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Taras_Potatos wrote:
In 1993, Russia was given the guarantee that there would be no NATO expansion eastwards.
Well, guess that´s one more broken promise, to add to the many previous. Combined with how many big invasions have come from the west, anyone being surprised that Russia is wary is an idiot.


And Gorby (M. Gorbachev) said that there was no such promise. ;)
http://www.zdf.de/ZDFmediathek/beitrag/video/2273826/Der-traurige-Held-der-Perestroika#/beitrag/video/2273826/Der-traurige-Held-der-Perestroika

UPD.


This interview is extremely interesting, Taras! It answers a long-standing question of mine. Thank you for posting the link.

Personally I was never sure whether this supposed promise ever existed or not - and tended to give people like Tenshinai some credibility when they claimed that the promise (that NATO would never expand east) had been made. But in this interview Gorbatchev himself actually clearly says no such promise was given. (Unless one assumes the interpreter is lying).

***

Now this of course doesn't automatically mean that expanding NATO eastwards is necessarily a good idea and that Russia won't feel threatened by it. That's an entirely different and very difficult question and I think everybody can agree that it is understandable that Russia feels troubled by it.
Nevertheless: the claim that the West broke promises clearly is a fabrication.

What isn't a fabrication is that Russia broke its treaty with Ukraine in which it had guaranteed Ukraine's territorial integrity - including Crimea - in return for Ukraine giving up its nuclear arsenal.
That treaty existed and was blatantly broken by sending in an invasion force.

Now - the deed is done and one has to accept reality and find a negotiated solution all sides can live with. That however necessitates that Russia takes a critical look at its own actions too. The current policy of 'we never did anything wrong - its ALL the West's fault' isn't helpful. Both sides need to admit their own mistakes and come together. Otherwise this will never work.

***

EDIT: To clear up some misconception: We must not forget that the current crisis isn't about Ukraine joining NATO. That was never the question. The question is EU-membership - a political and economical entity, not a military one. The EU does not pose any military threat to Russia. So the claimed but now refuted 'promise' about no NATO eastward expansion should never have come into the discussion at all really.
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Re: Ukraine
Post by Michael Riddell   » Wed Dec 03, 2014 8:01 pm

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Maybe more people in Ukraine should have voted for Darth Vader:

http://www.newsweek.com/darth-vader-runs-prime-minister-ukraine-vowing-take-back-crimea-putin-279629

Somehow I don't think anyone paid George Lucas or Disney any royalties....

Mike. ;)
---------------------
Gonnae no DAE that!

Why?

Just gonnae NO!
---------------------
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Re: Ukraine
Post by Taras_Potatos   » Thu Dec 04, 2014 3:57 pm

Taras_Potatos
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Location: Ukraine

Michael Riddell wrote:Maybe more people in Ukraine should have voted for Darth Vader:

http://www.newsweek.com/darth-vader-runs-prime-minister-ukraine-vowing-take-back-crimea-putin-279629

Somehow I don't think anyone paid George Lucas or Disney any royalties....

Mike. ;)

Thank you, but no. ))
And i think you'r right about royalties...

RuSSian news@work
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R4408llIxr8

Maybe you people can explain to me why Ban Ki-moon said that today's events in Grozny (Chechnya) are the actions of terrorists and similar events in Ukraine - the rebels?
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Re: Ukraine
Post by Taras_Potatos   » Fri Dec 05, 2014 6:26 pm

Taras_Potatos
Lieutenant (Senior Grade)

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Location: Ukraine

BtW today is 20 anniversary of Budapest memorandum.
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Re: Ukraine
Post by Taras_Potatos   » Tue Jan 13, 2015 6:10 am

Taras_Potatos
Lieutenant (Senior Grade)

Posts: 86
Joined: Fri Mar 14, 2014 4:04 pm
Location: Ukraine

One base to rule them all – five facts you should know about Russia’s main invasion hub

On January 6, @DajeyPetros spotted that the latest updated Google Earth satellite images revealed / included the base, many people knew about, but nobody could ever locate due to Russian army security measure to not leak meaningful footage of it and the lack of recent satellite footage from the area.

http://conflictreport.info/2015/01/08/one-base-to-rule-them-all-five-facts-you-should-know-about-russias-main-invasion-hub/

American Association of Advanced Science (AAAS)
Satellite Imagery Assessment of the Crisis in Ukraine: Part Two: Border Deployments

http://www.aaas.org/page/satellite-imagery-assessment-crisis-ukraine-part-two-border-deployments
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