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(Spoilers) UH questions and discussion

Join us in talking discussing all things Honor, including (but not limited to) tactics, favorite characters, and book discussions.
Re: (Spoilers) UH questions and disescussion
Post by JohnRoth   » Sat Oct 20, 2018 4:22 pm

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PeterZ wrote:We know that Emily scheduled a clinic visit to have another child. We don't know if Allyson Harrington helped Emily beyond ensuring the child could respond to regen therapies. One suspects that since Emily knew she was dying, she may ask Allyson to incorporate the DNA of both Emily's spouses into her child. Her interest in Honor's descriptions about Raoul and Katherine's potential mind voices suggests that possibility intrigues Emily. Even if Emily doesn't choose that option, Honor was considering another child.

Will either child incorporate Emily's,Honor's and Hamish's combined DNA, including the Meyerdahl Beta mods?

Also, Allyson and Alfred are having more kids that will be approximately Raoul and Kate's ages. That suggests NextGen Honorverse will have between 4-6 (if twins arise) related characters.

Finally, the Alpha Star Lines have incorporated the Meyerdahl beta mods into their own designs. That suggests to me that Isobel Bardasano and her line may well have the same "demon" that Alfred and Honor combat. The sort of insanity/instability described as inherent in the Bardasano line aligns well with either Alfred's demon or The Salamander unchecked by a fundemental compassionate and loving nature.

Furthermore, assuming that the Detweilers have a similar mod, their response to Albrecht's death also jives with a demon freed from the constraints of a compassionate nature. The extremes that Jack McBryde rebelled against suggests that the Harrington Demon permeates the MAlign and encourages the responses resulting in the Beowulf attack, the Yawata strike and Operation Buccaneer. Heck, it drove the MAlign into their current grand plan instead of a centuries long PR campaign to gently persuade the rest of the galaxy.


The relevant conversations are in AAC, chapters 16, 18 and 59. There is no suggestion there of using any of Honor's genetic material, so I doubt if the child is going to get the Meyerdhal Beta mods.

The tendency to unreasoning anger doesn't come from the Meyerdhal mods. It comes from the base Mesa Alpha genome, which Stephanie Harrington's mother had, and which is apparently being passed down as another "locked" mod. At least, I don't see any way an unlocked mod would have survived through that many generations of random assortment without either intervention or mating only with people who has the same mod.

If it had come down with the Meyerdhal mods, Sphinx would have been even more of a hotbed of clan warfare, etc, than it's portrayed in From the Highlands with on Gryphon.
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Re: (Spoilers) UH questions and discussion
Post by PeterZ   » Sat Oct 20, 2018 8:00 pm

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Snerk Allert.

John, the pertinent discussion inquestion happened in UH. Emily's second child was conceived shortly before she passed away. Her comments leading up to her passing suggest several bits of happy news. Her second child is but one item.
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Re: (Spoilers) UH questions and discussion
Post by JohnRoth   » Sat Oct 20, 2018 8:57 pm

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PeterZ wrote:Snerk Allert.

John, the pertinent discussion in question happened in UH. Emily's second child was conceived shortly before she passed away. Her comments leading up to her passing suggest several bits of happy news. Her second child is but one item.


If those are the only two scenes, IMHO there's nothing there. If they'd have intended to include any of Honor's DNA, Honor would have known --- medical ethics would ensure that. She'd also have known about the pending visit to the medical facility to do it, etc., so it would not have been a surprise. The timing, possibly. The fact, not. The chit-chat indicates that staff does not want to tell her whatever it is, because she has too much on her plate already.
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Re: (Spoilers) UH questions and discussion
Post by tlb   » Sat Oct 20, 2018 9:42 pm

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PeterZ wrote:Snerk Alert.

I as understand things: a snerk is about something not yet published; if it has been published then you only have a spoiler. So we are good, because this thread is specifically about UH spoilers.
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Re: (Spoilers) UH questions and discussion
Post by PeterZ   » Sat Oct 20, 2018 10:08 pm

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JohnRoth wrote:
PeterZ wrote:Snerk Allert.

John, the pertinent discussion in question happened in UH. Emily's second child was conceived shortly before she passed away. Her comments leading up to her passing suggest several bits of happy news. Her second child is but one item.


If those are the only two scenes, IMHO there's nothing there. If they'd have intended to include any of Honor's DNA, Honor would have known --- medical ethics would ensure that. She'd also have known about the pending visit to the medical facility to do it, etc., so it would not have been a surprise. The timing, possibly. The fact, not. The chit-chat indicates that staff does not want to tell her whatever it is, because she has too much on her plate already.

There may not be anything there. Then again RFC may well include a more heavily modified hero to make the MAlign's position a much grayer proposition. We already know the visible Mesan Alignment holds views that are pretty much the mainstreem in the Honorverse. Having one of Honor's children heavily modified may well be plot device we will run into.
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Re: (Spoilers) UH questions and discussion
Post by ldwechsler   » Sun Oct 21, 2018 4:30 pm

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JohnRoth wrote:
PeterZ wrote:Snerk Allert.

John, the pertinent discussion in question happened in UH. Emily's second child was conceived shortly before she passed away. Her comments leading up to her passing suggest several bits of happy news. Her second child is but one item.


If those are the only two scenes, IMHO there's nothing there. If they'd have intended to include any of Honor's DNA, Honor would have known --- medical ethics would ensure that. She'd also have known about the pending visit to the medical facility to do it, etc., so it would not have been a surprise. The timing, possibly. The fact, not. The chit-chat indicates that staff does not want to tell her whatever it is, because she has too much on her plate already.

There may not be anything there. Then again RFC may well include a more heavily modified hero to make the MAlign's position a much grayer proposition. We already know the visible Mesan Alignment holds views that are pretty much the mainstreem in the Honorverse. Having one of Honor's children heavily modified may well be plot device we will run into.[/quote]

I think that's dubious...the idea of heavy modifications. RFC does not really LIKE those things. Yes, Honor is a genie and the people on Grayson have been modified, but they are all very clearly human.

I think the children not only Raoul but all the others no matter who is the mother will have great communication with the cats. It would be an interesting footnote in the nature vs. nurture debate (which really shouldn't be one because they really blend together so often) if Emily's baby has the same kind of connections that Raoul has. After all, Hamish has also been adopted which confuses the issue a bit more.

But we have seen the Detweiler boys and they seem remarkably normal. They're married, have kids, and the normal issues that really rich parents have. I think a lot of the mods are relatively subtle, perhaps higher intelligence and resistance to illness, etc.

Slaves are sort of bred in large lots in terms of size and muscles and, of course, pleasure slaves are beautiful. But except for some strange cosmetic things (like a few people with sort of animal elements in their features) they seem basically pretty normal.
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Re: (Spoilers) UH questions and discussion
Post by tlb   » Sun Oct 21, 2018 5:46 pm

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PeterZ wrote:Snerk Allert.

John, the pertinent discussion in question happened in UH. Emily's second child was conceived shortly before she passed away. Her comments leading up to her passing suggest several bits of happy news. Her second child is but one item.


JohnRoth wrote:If those are the only two scenes, IMHO there's nothing there. If they'd have intended to include any of Honor's DNA, Honor would have known --- medical ethics would ensure that. She'd also have known about the pending visit to the medical facility to do it, etc., so it would not have been a surprise. The timing, possibly. The fact, not. The chit-chat indicates that staff does not want to tell her whatever it is, because she has too much on her plate already.

PeterZ wrote:There may not be anything there. Then again RFC may well include a more heavily modified hero to make the MAlign's position a much grayer proposition. We already know the visible Mesan Alignment holds views that are pretty much the mainstreem in the Honorverse. Having one of Honor's children heavily modified may well be plot device we will run into.


ldwechsler wrote:I think that's dubious...the idea of heavy modifications. RFC does not really LIKE those things. Yes, Honor is a genie and the people on Grayson have been modified, but they are all very clearly human.

I think the children not only Raoul but all the others no matter who is the mother will have great communication with the cats. It would be an interesting footnote in the nature vs. nurture debate (which really shouldn't be one because they really blend together so often) if Emily's baby has the same kind of connections that Raoul has. After all, Hamish has also been adopted which confuses the issue a bit more.

It is clear from the short story of Honor's parents meeting, that her father had a near telepathic connection to know where she was at all time.
It has been shown in the books that Honor and Nimitz have a much stronger connection than other bonded pairs; they can even send pictures back and forth.
Then there is the scene with Honor's son sensing another's mind glow.

All these things mean there is something in the Harrington gene pool that others do not have. So Emily's children will not have the same connection that Honor's have.
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Re: (Spoilers) UH questions and discussion
Post by PeterZ   » Sun Oct 21, 2018 6:32 pm

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Indeed the Harrington line will have something Emily's won't. That and Emily's apparent interest in that connection RFC touched on in the negotiation scene with Raoul suggests Emily may want to have a child genetically connected to all three spouses. Connected that way as well as perhaps having a stronger mind voice like Raoul and Honor.

Emily's pending death/failing health would have encouraged her to leave a legacy for both her spouses in the form of a child by all three of their genetics.
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Re: (Spoilers) UH questions and discussion
Post by TFLYTSNBN   » Sun Oct 21, 2018 8:49 pm

TFLYTSNBN

PeterZ wrote:Indeed the Harrington line will have something Emily's won't. That and Emily's apparent interest in that connection RFC touched on in the negotiation scene with Raoul suggests Emily may want to have a child genetically connected to all three spouses. Connected that way as well as perhaps having a stronger mind voice like Raoul and Honor.

Emily's pending death/failing health would have encouraged her to leave a legacy for both her spouses in the form of a child by all three of their genetics.


I know that Emily is crippled by her accident and any incorporation of Honor's aswell as Emily and Hamish's DNA would occur in the labratory, but the ideastill inspires amusing imagery of a menage au troi.
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Re: (Spoilers) UH questions and discussion
Post by Brigade XO   » Sun Oct 21, 2018 9:15 pm

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TFLYTSNBN wrote:I know that Emily is crippled by her accident and any incorporation of Honor's aswell as Emily and Hamish's DNA would occur in the labratory, but the ideastill inspires amusing imagery of a menage au troi.


Not so much fun actually, more like Allison doing some probably fairly simple sampling of Hornor's DNA and stitching it into a sample of Emily's- at Emily's request with proper medical documentation and releases on Emily's part- before combining it with Hamish's to give Emily the combined DNA child she wanted.
Just because we can't do that now doesn't mean Allison (and Emily's GNY team) can't do that prior to Emily's death. They don't even have to change anything, just graft in replacement DNA from Emily's spouse.
The only real question is would it be something prohibited under the Beowulf (and, of course Manticroian) code of medical ethics. I don't think it would be.
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