Topic Actions

Topic Search

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot], TangoLima and 16 guests

SPOILER end of the MA

Join us in talking discussing all things Honor, including (but not limited to) tactics, favorite characters, and book discussions.
Re: SPOILER end of the MA
Post by Annachie   » Sun Jun 10, 2018 10:45 pm

Annachie
Admiral

Posts: 2220
Joined: Fri Jun 17, 2011 7:36 pm

iirc, the main reason they didn't suspect the peeps raiding in Silesia was that it was damn near a 4 or 6 month trip to get there since they couldn't use the WHJ's.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
You are so going to die. :p ~~~~ runsforcelery
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
still not dead. :)
Top
Re: SPOILER end of the MA
Post by Weird Harold   » Sun Jun 10, 2018 11:46 pm

Weird Harold
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 4254
Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2014 10:25 pm
Location: "Lost Wages", NV

PeterZ wrote:So, it doesn't matter that the GA won't need to patrol all of the galaxy, they will be building most of the ships that will patrol the galaxy.


The SEM is not the GA, and even the members of the GA individually and collectively aren't the only place capable of building ships competitive with pirates or "Haven Sector" designs that can be competitive with anything except Apollo.

The entire "Haven sector," including The Anderman Empire, Erewhon, M.A.R.S, won't be able to support the demand for new hyper-capable warships, not that every newly independent system is going to want to buy anything from or be indebted to the GA.

The GA can more effectively provide ships to those who need them by licensing (export) ship and missile designs, along with specs on Grayson-style dispersed yard to build them.
.
.
.
Answers! I got lots of answers!

(Now if I could just find the right questions.)
Top
Re: SPOILER end of the MA
Post by PeterZ   » Mon Jun 11, 2018 1:18 am

PeterZ
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 5704
Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2011 1:11 pm
Location: Colorado

Weird Harold wrote:
PeterZ wrote:So, it doesn't matter that the GA won't need to patrol all of the galaxy, they will be building most of the ships that will patrol the galaxy.


The SEM is not the GA, and even the members of the GA individually and collectively aren't the only place capable of building ships competitive with pirates or "Haven Sector" designs that can be competitive with anything except Apollo.

The entire "Haven sector," including The Anderman Empire, Erewhon, M.A.R.S, won't be able to support the demand for new hyper-capable warships, not that every newly independent system is going to want to buy anything from or be indebted to the GA.

The GA can more effectively provide ships to those who need them by licensing (export) ship and missile designs, along with specs on Grayson-style dispersed yard to build them.


That works for Core Worlds, but the ex-Prtectorates might needs upgrades t their industrial base. The worlds without the needed industrial base will need the Haven Sector yards initially. Once they upgrade their capabilities, licensing is a viable alternative. All in all, Haven Sector building slips will be working on lighter combatants for the GA and for exports to those newly independent systems.
Top
Re: SPOILER end of the MA
Post by Weird Harold   » Mon Jun 11, 2018 1:58 am

Weird Harold
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 4254
Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2014 10:25 pm
Location: "Lost Wages", NV

PeterZ wrote:
Weird Harold wrote:The GA can more effectively provide ships to those who need them by licensing (export) ship and missile designs, along with specs on Grayson-style dispersed yard to build them.


That works for Core Worlds, but the ex-Prtectorates might needs upgrades t their industrial base. The worlds without the needed industrial base will need the Haven Sector yards initially. he GA and for exports to those newly independent systems.


That also works to make core worlds or more developed non-league systems, arms providers. Needing an outside builder doesn't mean needing a Haven Sector Yard. Especially for system on the far side of former League space from Manticore where delivery alone could take six-months or more even with wormhole access. That doesn't include build time or waiting list position.
.
.
.
Answers! I got lots of answers!

(Now if I could just find the right questions.)
Top
Re: SPOILER end of the MA
Post by George J. Smith   » Mon Jun 11, 2018 3:44 am

George J. Smith
Captain of the List

Posts: 741
Joined: Tue Feb 19, 2013 7:48 am
Location: Ross-on-Wye UK

The biggest problem with licensing designs is those designs getting into the hands of the MA through their proxies in the RF.

There is textev of the Detweiler boys complaining about the micro fusion plants the SEM developed, unless the missile designs to be licenced are capacitor only types then the micro fusion plant design is going to be available, and that micro fusion plant is what allows the SEM equipment to be so powerful.

It looks to me that 20 years down the road when/if the story continues, the MA will have comparable ships & weapons to the GA.
.
T&R
GJS

A man should live forever, or die in the attempt
Spider Robinson Callahan's Crosstime Saloon (1977) A voice is heard in Ramah
Top
Re: SPOILER end of the MA
Post by Weird Harold   » Mon Jun 11, 2018 5:05 am

Weird Harold
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 4254
Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2014 10:25 pm
Location: "Lost Wages", NV

George J. Smith wrote:The biggest problem with licensing designs is those designs getting into the hands of the MA through their proxies in the RF.


That's why I qualified that with (export).

Havenite designs and Havenite LACs are more than adequate for system defense forces, and their small ships are more than sufficient for anti-piracy work.

Andermani ships are adequate, as are the Marksman/Arsenal combinations from Erewhon/M.A.R.S.

AS I said earlier, the SEM is not the GA and there is no reason the rest of the GA can't support the arms merchant/MAGC inventory without exposing the SEM's Ghost Rider secrets to plagiarism.

Some of those secrets, like the Hermes Buoy and FTL comms are going to get around, if in slightly less miniaturized versions, because they are just to revolutionary and useful. Others are already trying to duplicate FTL comms, so it won't be long before there are competing systems on the open market, anyway.
.
.
.
Answers! I got lots of answers!

(Now if I could just find the right questions.)
Top
Re: SPOILER end of the MA
Post by n7axw   » Mon Jun 11, 2018 9:05 am

n7axw
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 5100
Joined: Wed Jan 22, 2014 8:54 pm
Location: Viborg, SD

Actually, if what you are concerned with are pirates, Nevadas, Indefatigables and other Solly designs are perfectly seviceable...and a lot cheaper. Thousands of them out there now that OFS is dismantling. It becomes more dicey if you have agressive neighbors to worry about.

Don

-
When any group seeks political power in God's name, both religion and politics are instantly corrupted.
Top
Re: SPOILER end of the MA
Post by PeterZ   » Mon Jun 11, 2018 9:35 am

PeterZ
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 5704
Joined: Fri Apr 01, 2011 1:11 pm
Location: Colorado

Those SLN BCs are the reason the Haven Sector has to produce export warships. If they don't, the Solarian League 2.0 controls who gets those ships without counter balance. That control will mean star nations closest to the SL 2.0 becomes most secure, while all others are less secure. So while the GA is not the SEM, the GA has common cause with the SEM to improve the lot of those star nations most friendly with the GA nations.

GA nations can't possibly supply all the warships demanded, but not ramping up production means their allies will be dependent on the kindness of the new League. Not a proposition ex-Protectorates will take kindly to, nor one to engender trust in the GA. It would strike many newly independent star nations that the GA isn't really interested in any sort of change beyond that which improves the GA's lot. While providing those export warships does allow those newly independent systems a chance at establishing their own sovereignty and true independence.
Top
Re: SPOILER end of the MA
Post by Theemile   » Mon Jun 11, 2018 9:53 am

Theemile
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 3158
Joined: Sat Feb 27, 2010 5:50 pm
Location: Toledo, Ohio USA

n7axw wrote:Actually, if what you are concerned with are pirates, Nevadas, Indefatigables and other Solly designs are perfectly seviceable...and a lot cheaper. Thousands of them out there now that OFS is dismantling. It becomes more dicey if you have agressive neighbors to worry about.

Don

-


The Office of Frontier Services is dismantling - NOT the Frontier Fleet of the Solarian League Navy.

Yes, FF was essentially OFS's puppet, but they are not the same organization, and FF's breakup was not part of Honor's terms - just it's immediate withdraw to SL space was. It is not going away any time soon,

That being said, it's mandate will probably change, as the volume it needs to patrol has drastically shrunk.

At the same time, over the last 2 years the RMN has picked off ~10% of Frontier Fleet. It still is a massive beast, but it is smaller then it was when this all stared.

So will it's disposition change? Most assuredly. Will it sell off unnecessary ships? Possibly. Will we see a liquidation of the FF or major portions of it? Extremely doubtful.
******
RFC said "refitting a Beowulfan SD to Manticoran standards would be just as difficult as refitting a standard SLN SD to those standards. In other words, it would be cheaper and faster to build new ships."
Top
Re: SPOILER end of the MA
Post by Theemile   » Mon Jun 11, 2018 10:15 am

Theemile
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 3158
Joined: Sat Feb 27, 2010 5:50 pm
Location: Toledo, Ohio USA

PeterZ wrote:Those SLN BCs are the reason the Haven Sector has to produce export warships. If they don't, the Solarian League 2.0 controls who gets those ships without counter balance. That control will mean star nations closest to the SL 2.0 becomes most secure, while all others are less secure. So while the GA is not the SEM, the GA has common cause with the SEM to improve the lot of those star nations most friendly with the GA nations.

GA nations can't possibly supply all the warships demanded, but not ramping up production means their allies will be dependent on the kindness of the new League. Not a proposition ex-Protectorates will take kindly to, nor one to engender trust in the GA. It would strike many newly independent star nations that the GA isn't really interested in any sort of change beyond that which improves the GA's lot. While providing those export warships does allow those newly independent systems a chance at establishing their own sovereignty and true independence.


And that's where the RMN should leverege it's Silesian shipyards. Adapt a tried export quality design - Say a modded 1900 Chanson/Apollo/Star Knight design, and upgrade those yards to build them in bulk. It keeps those idle hands busy while providing important, Imperial jobs to the Sector.

It allows the fleet yards to concentrate on maintaining the rebuilding the fleet while upping the # of export ships available.

Haven, of course just needs to sell an export version of it's Mars class CAs, and similar DD/CLS.
******
RFC said "refitting a Beowulfan SD to Manticoran standards would be just as difficult as refitting a standard SLN SD to those standards. In other words, it would be cheaper and faster to build new ships."
Top

Return to Honorverse