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Sidearms

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Re: Sidearms
Post by Weird Harold   » Mon Apr 16, 2018 12:43 pm

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jtg452 wrote:That being said, I do love me a good caliber war. Forewarning, I'm of the "big, heavy bullets knocks crap down" school of thought.


You might consider that the "Speed Kills" club won; as soon as 3mm and 5mm pulsers became available, "Big Hole" chem burners were relegated to museums and the SCA.
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Re: Sidearms
Post by jtg452   » Mon Apr 16, 2018 8:25 pm

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Weird Harold wrote:
jtg452 wrote:That being said, I do love me a good caliber war. Forewarning, I'm of the "big, heavy bullets knocks crap down" school of thought.


You might consider that the "Speed Kills" club won; as soon as 3mm and 5mm pulsers became available, "Big Hole" chem burners were relegated to museums and the SCA.

Yup, they have. In this fictional universe, at least.

Until such are available in the real world, I'll stick with big, slow, and heavy.
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Re: Sidearms
Post by Fox2!   » Mon Apr 16, 2018 9:27 pm

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dscott8 wrote:

There may have been "caliber conflicts" among Grayson shooters, simply because people are human and will debate damn near anything. They probably argued over their beer about the merits of Ford, Chevy and Dodge ground cars.



Graysons would consider the Caliber Wars to be part of their Test.

There is One True Caliber, and John Moses Browning is it's Prophet.
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Re: Sidearms
Post by pappilon   » Tue Apr 17, 2018 4:25 am

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Fox2! wrote:
dscott8 wrote:

There may have been "caliber conflicts" among Grayson shooters, simply because people are human and will debate damn near anything. They probably argued over their beer about the merits of Ford, Chevy and Dodge ground cars.



Graysons would consider the Caliber Wars to be part of their Test.

There is One True Caliber, and John Moses Browning is it's Prophet.


That would be the .380 aka Browning 9mm? :lol: :lol:

Oh, and PS the .40 cal 10mm difference is more akin to the .38 police special and the .357 Mag. The .40 is for antipersonnel the 10mm is more for protection in the brush. Unless you really enjoy firing off 50-100 rounds of .50 S&W or .44 mag. Frankly my wrist hurts enough after 20 rounds.
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Re: Sidearms
Post by jtg452   » Tue Apr 17, 2018 9:56 am

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pappilon wrote:That would be the .380 aka Browning 9mm? :lol: :lol:

Oh, and PS the .40 cal 10mm difference is more akin to the .38 police special and the .357 Mag. The .40 is for antipersonnel the 10mm is more for protection in the brush. Unless you really enjoy firing off 50-100 rounds of .50 S&W or .44 mag. Frankly my wrist hurts enough after 20 rounds.

I think he was referring to the .45ACP. Although, JMB (BBHN) is responsible for developing all of the 'ACP' (Automatic Colt Pistol) rounds, so there are several candidates. Along with obscure rounds like the .50BMG.

Not that there's anything wrong with .380ACP.

It, like it's slightly longer cousin the 9mm Parabellum, makes a fine hide out gun and is useful to the old, infirm, small statured, petite women, children, the injured and those that just aren't willing to learn how to handle a gun chambered for a full sized cartridge. :lol: :mrgreen:

The differences between the .40 Slow and Weak and the 10mm are a lot more than you are making out. They share a common bore diameter and that's about it.
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Re: Sidearms
Post by Fox2!   » Tue Apr 17, 2018 11:26 pm

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pappilon wrote:
Fox2! wrote:

There is One True Caliber, and John Moses Browning is it's Prophet.


That would be the .380 aka Browning 9mm? :lol: :lol:

Oh, and PS the .40 cal 10mm difference is more akin to the .38 police special and the .357 Mag. The .40 is for antipersonnel the 10mm is more for protection in the brush. Unless you really enjoy firing off 50-100 rounds of .50 S&W or .44 mag. Frankly my wrist hurts enough after 20 rounds.


Calibers for real handguns begin with "4" in English measure, and "1" in that Revolutionary French stuff. And have two digits.
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Re: Sidearms
Post by Weird Harold   » Tue Apr 17, 2018 11:32 pm

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Fox2! wrote:Calibers for real handguns begin with "4" in English measure, and "1" in that Revolutionary French stuff. And have two digits.


Piker! You should add 1 to both of those numbers. (although I don't actually know of any production handguns in 20mm.) The .50 Desert Eagle is THE handgun for the Big Hole club. (For now. :D)
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Re: Sidearms
Post by jtg452   » Wed Apr 18, 2018 9:12 am

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Weird Harold wrote:
Fox2! wrote:Calibers for real handguns begin with "4" in English measure, and "1" in that Revolutionary French stuff. And have two digits.


Piker! You should add 1 to both of those numbers. (although I don't actually know of any production handguns in 20mm.) The .50 Desert Eagle is THE handgun for the Big Hole club. (For now. :D)

Desert Eagles are too big. Cool guns but they went to one frame size when the .50AE was released and it's right on the border of being too big to hold onto for me.

There's also the .50GI. It's a .45ACP length (and operating pressure) .50 caliber round that the folks at Guncrafters developed about 15 years ago.

While it's not putting out huge numbers, there is something to be said for throwing 2/3 of an ounce of lead at 3/4 the speed of sound.

The ATF doesn't allow bores bigger than .500 for non replicas. You can still get an antique .577 howdah pistol but you can't make a .577 revolver and try to sell it on the open market.

That's why the .50AE wasn't built to use the old buffalo gun bullets. The original design was really a .51 just like the old buffalo gun cartridges but the ATF told IMI that they wouldn't be able to sell it in the US if the bore was over .500 without it being controlled like full autos under NFA'34 (over .500 bores are considered 'any other weapons'), so a redesign was made.
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Re: Sidearms
Post by Maldorian   » Thu Apr 19, 2018 3:57 pm

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Take a Five-Seven. Uses said Five Point Seven Milimeter Bullets from the Belgish P90 submashine Gun.

Should be a reason why this gun is forbidden for free sale even in Weapon Country nummer one, the United States. If I remember correct, the reason is, because the Five-Seven Ammo is Armor piercing, something Cops don´t like to see.

And you shouldn´t forget: What use has a big gun, if you knock yourself out with the recoil of the gun. Firepower isn´t erverything. You have to control that power or it is useless.

That be said, my personal opinion is, that .50 guns are useless, because your enemy with a small gun has killed you alredy 5 times before you can hit him. You couldn´t targeting good and fast with a heavy gun and the first shoot breakes your balance, so if you miss, your enemy has his chance to kill you.

It is like the most things in life: you need the balance between the extreme sides!

In case of weapons, the balance between firepower and handling.
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Re: Sidearms
Post by PeterZ   » Thu Apr 19, 2018 5:08 pm

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Now that the tree cats have proven they can learn to shoot, will mini-pulsers be supplied to the clans? The clans will have supplied body guards for humans. They and the body guards should be compensated. Otherwise, it sets the precedent for not paying tree cats.

So what will the 'cat enclaves on Sphynx look like when next we visit the Honorverse?

I can see them having power tools, manufactured tree-homes, clan owned greenhouses and computers. Yes, computers. By the time the Raoul reaches adulthood, the 'cats will have mastered reading and writing. That means they can use computers to better communicate with everyone.

Will they then be ready to further hire out their services? Nannies, policecats, interrogators, legal aides for lawyers and a host of other professions.

Heck, I can see treecasts wreaking havoc on Sphynxian lawyers. The opposing lawyer has the 'cat parsing any answers in a deposition to direct followup inquiries. On Harrington Steading, the magistrate will have their own lie detectors to parse what the participants in the court are saying.

I really wonder what the future holds for the Honorverse.
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