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A Question about Sandra Crandalls conduct in Meyers

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A Question about Sandra Crandalls conduct in Meyers
Post by Eagleeye   » Fri Dec 22, 2017 11:52 am

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If I remember correctly, Fleet Admiral Sandra Crandall didn't had only 71 SDs, but roughly the same number of screen and logistics units in her command. And after the return of the dispatch boat from New Tuscany, she had also blood in her eyes. So why did she not order some of the screen units at least to patrol along the hyperlimit, especially in the area where vessels from the Talbott Quadrant most probably would leave hyperspace? In my opinion, something like that should be Standard Operation Procedure.
After all, she was near an area she intended to attack - and maybe she would be lucky and catch some merchant or so - or some unfortunate diplomatic courier (like HMS Reprise ...) - which wouldn't be able to get back to Spindle and spoil the surprise for Admiral Gold Peak. Oops ...
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Re: A Question about Sandra Crandalls conduct in Meyers
Post by Weird Harold   » Fri Dec 22, 2017 1:37 pm

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Eagleeye wrote: So why did she not order some of the screen units at least to patrol along the hyperlimit, ...


Adm Crandall was one of the MAlign's "three stooges." Between her, Adm Filareta, and Adm Byng, they might have been able to muster up a single functional brain-cell not tainted by Solarian arrogance.

In the specific case of picketing the approaches to Meyers, she was possibly far too busy trying to meet her self-imposed deadline of departing for Spindle in 72(?) hours after hearing about Adm Byng's demise.
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Answers! I got lots of answers!

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Re: A Question about Sandra Crandalls conduct in Meyers
Post by Theemile   » Fri Dec 22, 2017 1:44 pm

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Eagleeye wrote:If I remember correctly, Fleet Admiral Sandra Crandall didn't had only 71 SDs, but roughly the same number of screen and logistics units in her command. And after the return of the dispatch boat from New Tuscany, she had also blood in her eyes. So why did she not order some of the screen units at least to patrol along the hyperlimit, especially in the area where vessels from the Talbott Quadrant most probably would leave hyperspace? In my opinion, something like that should be Standard Operation Procedure.
After all, she was near an area she intended to attack - and maybe she would be lucky and catch some merchant or so - or some unfortunate diplomatic courier (like HMS Reprise ...) - which wouldn't be able to get back to Spindle and spoil the surprise for Admiral Gold Peak. Oops ...



You would think....

But the answer is No, she brought her entire force across the wall together and then when she decided to pull the trigger, they moved as one on Spindle. No pickets, no comm ships. no intradicting forces at the hyperlimit, no tactical scouting.

She came in fat dumb and lazy with no mention of a tactical defensive cloud , or anything. Really it was kind of plot driven. She could have dispersed her light units for the several days she spent "talking" to the government, allowing them to scout the system and cover the flanks... but no.
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Re: A Question about Sandra Crandalls conduct in Meyers
Post by quite possibly a cat   » Fri Dec 22, 2017 3:18 pm

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Byng was terrible! I wanted to smack him for being so stupid. He could have gotten such perfect revenge against the Manties, and he blew it!

1) He should have ordered all non-SLN ships to come to a nice orbit, declare themselves and power-down as soon as possible. Any other assets they have in space need to be declared and powered down as well. If the manties cooperate you can just skip to "4", since refusal to cooperate proves guilt.

2) Assuming you get compliance, you can then start the investigation. First you need to secure any armed ships. This means the crews will have to get out, but you do have some spare space in the brig. You'll also obviously need full control and access to every ship. The civilian ships should be cleared pretty quickly because they don't randomly carry nukes or stealth tech. That leaves the Mantie military ships.

3) The investigation would find nothing amiss with any ship at all, except one of the probes that the Manties super stealthy probes they supposedly launched is missing. Not there. So weird. Didn't find anything at the spot they declared a drone was at. Of course, after searching the reports you find an example of Manties using nuke armed stealth drones as a weapon. It fits their MO. They can't account for the drone. And this is the star nation that stiffed them. You have means, motive, opportunity, them lying, and it matches tech only they have.

4) Finally you finish up by interrogating a Manty captain who has been steeped in the Saganami tradition. Obviously there will be assorted people to observe so you don't mistreat the Manty captain. After you point out that the Manties are pirates since there wasn't a declared war, and unless there is evidence that the rest of the crew is innocent you'll execute them all, he'll confess to the whole thing and say his crew had nothing to do with it.

At this point you seize the ship from the captain that confessed and now have all the fancy Manty tech.

Either way, you have proof the Manties did it, and you have a confession. Case closed. Manties just murdered over forty thousand civilians as far as anyone else knows.

As a free bonus, TIY will pay a ton for your prize ship. And your intelligence service will probably be pretty happy about getting to examine the probe you didn't find.
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Re: A Question about Sandra Crandalls conduct in Meyers
Post by JohnRoth   » Fri Dec 22, 2017 4:26 pm

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quite possibly a cat wrote:Byng was terrible! I wanted to smack him for being so stupid. He could have gotten such perfect revenge against the Manties, and he blew it!



Of course he was stupid. He was hand-picked by the MAlign as the most likely to create an incident that would give Crandall an excuse to get herself in the buzz-saw and escalate the confrontation.
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Re: A Question about Sandra Crandalls conduct in Meyers
Post by cthia   » Fri Dec 22, 2017 5:39 pm

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The human element.

Remember, to the Sollies, Manticorans and Manticoran tech are all the products of neobarbs. The SLN had a very low opinion on anything not built in the League or born in the League. There was no need for an 800# gorilla to take any precautions or even worry about a defenseless winged Manticore. It would have been like the Spartans fearing cavemen.

Although Byng was an idiot, he didn't exactly corner the market on it. Although, he may have been the best representative sample of the quintessential Solarian mindset.

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
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Re: A Question about Sandra Crandalls conduct in Meyers
Post by Sigs   » Fri Dec 22, 2017 5:46 pm

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quite possibly a cat wrote:
2) Assuming you get compliance, you can then start the investigation. First you need to secure any armed ships. This means the crews will have to get out, but you do have some spare space in the brig. You'll also obviously need full control and access to every ship. The civilian ships should be cleared pretty quickly because they don't randomly carry nukes or stealth tech. That leaves the Mantie military ships.


I doubt that the RMN would have willingly handed over control of their ships to the SLN. Suddenly the SLN has access to some very interesting technology and then what? They will find the RMN guilty, confiscate the ships and arrest the crew's. By the time Add Gold Peak hears about this Byng could have been far, far, far from New Tuscany.
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Re: A Question about Sandra Crandalls conduct in Meyers
Post by cthia   » Fri Dec 22, 2017 6:14 pm

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One could also ask why most Solarian forces never adopted any kind of plan before Tamaguchi. No strategy, no tactics. An army of steamrollers simply don't need to formulate any plans against an army of neobarbs (kids) riding on big wheels...

Image

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
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Re: A Question about Sandra Crandalls conduct in Meyers
Post by Loren Pechtel   » Fri Dec 22, 2017 9:45 pm

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The thing is she was expecting to be shooting fish in a barrel. Why isolate a unit where it might get picked off?

Theemile wrote:You would think....

But the answer is No, she brought her entire force across the wall together and then when she decided to pull the trigger, they moved as one on Spindle. No pickets, no comm ships. no intradicting forces at the hyperlimit, no tactical scouting.

She came in fat dumb and lazy with no mention of a tactical defensive cloud , or anything. Really it was kind of plot driven. She could have dispersed her light units for the several days she spent "talking" to the government, allowing them to scout the system and cover the flanks... but no.
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Re: A Question about Sandra Crandalls conduct in Meyers
Post by Loren Pechtel   » Fri Dec 22, 2017 9:49 pm

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quite possibly a cat wrote:Byng was terrible! I wanted to smack him for being so stupid. He could have gotten such perfect revenge against the Manties, and he blew it!


1) Byng didn't know his purpose was to create an incident.

2) Even if he had, he didn't know his true mission was to get killed.

3) The RMN would not have complied with a SLN order to stand down.
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