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[Spoiler - UH] utube snippet

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Re: [Spoiler - UH] utube snippet
Post by Eagleeye   » Sun Jan 07, 2018 9:59 am

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Brigade XO wrote:
Fun stuff like Albrects's children are going to be around and actively invoved for a few hundred years instead of "only" 150 or so. 300 year old Alpha Alignment demigods....not a pleasent thought.


If I remember correctly, at least 3rd generation Prolong is supposed to expand the life expectation to around 300 years or so. The Alignments Prolong boosters should make life even longer - but nobody knows for how much, because even 1st gen Prolong is only available less then 100 years and aside of war, suicide or incidents anyone who get 1st gen Prolong should still be alive.
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Re: [Spoiler - UH] utube snippet
Post by JohnRoth   » Sun Jan 07, 2018 10:10 am

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cthia wrote:One other thing I think bears mentioning. During Houdini there were entities (I forgot the name of them (Scrags?)) who were tasked with riding herd on some of the more risky charges. It reminds me of the People's Commissioners tasked with riding herd on some of the officers. Perhaps the same sort of ingredients from the human element could come into to play. Sympathy and empathy.

To be fair, the People's Commissioners spent lots of time with the officers, where in this case, time for the herders to bond with the riders may be absent. But still, emotional weakness can happen at the drop of a tear.


Dauntless wrote:I believe those guards were called GAULs and were very carefully trained/conditioned to make sure this exact problem did not happen


cthia wrote:Yes they are carefully trained/conditioned. But so too are the pleasure slaves and Jeremy X, and we both know the disappointment there. I don't think anyone could have been as "trained/conditioned" as is portrayed in the hideous info dump regarding the sex slaves.

Even within the GAULS lurks a bit of humanity. Hard to dispense with that element.


There's a substantial difference there. The way the pleasure slaves were treated was intended to break them. The GAUL's training would be exactly the opposite: deadly fighters who are carefully conditioned to have serious tunnel vision for their mission. They're basically portrayed as the death of the party.

The reason for breaking pleasure slaves before selling them is to insure that they won't have the self-confidence to do to their eventual masters what they richly deserve. Even so, they're still very dangerous property.

(I've seen nothing to suggest that Jeremy X was subjected to the same treatment.)

We've seen at least two people in the same general mold as pleasure slaves, and neither of them seemed to be particularly oppressed. Quite the opposite.
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Re: [Spoiler - UH] utube snippet
Post by cthia   » Sun Jan 07, 2018 11:03 am

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JohnRoth wrote:
cthia wrote:One other thing I think bears mentioning. During Houdini there were entities (I forgot the name of them (Scrags?)) who were tasked with riding herd on some of the more risky charges. It reminds me of the People's Commissioners tasked with riding herd on some of the officers. Perhaps the same sort of ingredients from the human element could come into to play. Sympathy and empathy.

To be fair, the People's Commissioners spent lots of time with the officers, where in this case, time for the herders to bond with the riders may be absent. But still, emotional weakness can happen at the drop of a tear.


Dauntless wrote:I believe those guards were called GAULs and were very carefully trained/conditioned to make sure this exact problem did not happen


cthia wrote:Yes they are carefully trained/conditioned. But so too are the pleasure slaves and Jeremy X, and we both know the disappointment there. I don't think anyone could have been as "trained/conditioned" as is portrayed in the hideous info dump regarding the sex slaves.

Even within the GAULS lurks a bit of humanity. Hard to dispense with that element.


There's a substantial difference there. The way the pleasure slaves were treated was intended to break them. The GAUL's training would be exactly the opposite: deadly fighters who are carefully conditioned to have serious tunnel vision for their mission. They're basically portrayed as the death of the party.

The reason for breaking pleasure slaves before selling them is to insure that they won't have the self-confidence to do to their eventual masters what they richly deserve. Even so, they're still very dangerous property.

(I've seen nothing to suggest that Jeremy X was subjected to the same treatment.)

We've seen at least two people in the same general mold as pleasure slaves, and neither of them seemed to be particularly oppressed. Quite the opposite.


You have a point and your logic is sound. Yet, we do not know what the detailed in-depth history is with the GAULS, as far as I know. We do not know what storms they have weathered, such as seeing loved ones exterminated -- possibly having to personally effect, or oversee, the extermination, having to witness and endure many in their line being culled, etc. The same with Bardasano. She could have witnessed an awful lot or horrors within her line as well. Since her featured Bardasano gene is a psychopathic killer that was meant to be culled.

All I'm saying is that I would imagine there are many negative vectors supplied by the heartless Malign that could have infected the GAULS. (See Simoes, see Jeremy X, see heartless Houdini). The Malign is simply a cesspool of emotional detachment and indifference, and life always finds a way. To live. It only takes one.

It seems that each line has an inherent weakness. The Detweiler gene's weakness is the delusional superiority Hitler-complex.

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
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Re: [Spoiler - UH] utube snippet
Post by quite possibly a cat   » Sun Jan 07, 2018 12:16 pm

quite possibly a cat
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cthia wrote:It seems that each line has an inherent weakness. The Detweiler gene's weakness is the delusional superiority Hitler-complex.

Yup. Also I think a serious unwillingness to really push the limits of their tech. Overly cautious in that department. I mean they want to create super-geniuses and the haven't even added a significant amount of brain mass! They also haven't created general AI, which would be really easy if they would just tweak a "human brain" a little to make it an "organic processor". They could grow it like they grow slaves! What about that Treecat they captured once? Have they even tried cloning it and networking its brain with a human brain? What's the worst that could happen?

Honestly, they're barely better than Beowulf!
[/ideas that would be rejected by the ethics committee of Manpower]

cthia wrote:Yes they are carefully trained/conditioned. But so too are the pleasure slaves and Jeremy X, and we both know the disappointment there. I don't think anyone could have been as "trained/conditioned" as is portrayed in the hideous info dump regarding the sex slaves.
I'm convinced the training isn't to really create loyal slaves. They can't be that stupid. Its to make Manpower look evil.
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Re: [Spoiler - UH] utube snippet
Post by cthia   » Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:57 pm

cthia
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quite possibly a cat wrote:
cthia wrote:One other thing I think bears mentioning. During Houdini there were entities (I forgot the name of them (Scrags?)) who were tasked with riding herd on some of the more risky charges. It reminds me of the People's Commissioners tasked with riding herd on some of the officers. Perhaps the same sort of ingredients from the human element could come into to play. Sympathy and empathy.

To be fair, the People's Commissioners spent lots of time with the officers, where in this case, time for the herders to bond with the riders may be absent. But still, emotional weakness can happen at the drop of a tear.

Scrags are descendants of the Ukrainian super-soldiers. I'm not sure what they were called, but they did have people to ride herd.

But the ones we've been shown are fanatics. Real fanatics who would calmly die for the cause if need be. One self-destructed a slaver-ship with himself on board. I don't think we saw this from the People's Commissioners.
As always, do forgive my bold to call attention.

Well... they were risking their lives if discovered and were held accountable to probably just as brutal and heartless a regime.

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
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Re: [Spoiler - UH] utube snippet
Post by cthia   » Wed Jan 10, 2018 9:47 am

cthia
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I notice that no one has mentioned the interesting tidbits regarding the treecats near the end of the snippet, which includes some very interesting morsels. More of treecat personalities is flushed out. Admittedly, I need to listen to the snippet again as well. I shall.

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
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Re: [Spoiler - UH] utube snippet
Post by Hans   » Wed Jan 10, 2018 10:25 am

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Hello,

cthia wrote:Admittedly, I need to listen to the snippet again as well. I shall.

... and i would (still) love to READ the snippet.
I'm to old to listen to ('hearing aid' but no chance) and additionally i'm not a native english speaker.
Please Mr. Weber give as the snippet like we got the others!
I know, i complain the 3rd(?) time, but it ain't funny to read about and not being able to follow the subject!
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Re: [Spoiler - UH] utube snippet
Post by Theemile   » Wed Jan 10, 2018 1:11 pm

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JohnRoth wrote:
There's a substantial difference there. The way the pleasure slaves were treated was intended to break them. The GAUL's training would be exactly the opposite: deadly fighters who are carefully conditioned to have serious tunnel vision for their mission. They're basically portrayed as the death of the party.

The reason for breaking pleasure slaves before selling them is to insure that they won't have the self-confidence to do to their eventual masters what they richly deserve. Even so, they're still very dangerous property.

(I've seen nothing to suggest that Jeremy X was subjected to the same treatment.)

We've seen at least two people in the same general mold as pleasure slaves, and neither of them seemed to be particularly oppressed. Quite the opposite.


Why stop at training, why could the GAULS not be a specific genetic mix? We're already looking for the markers for what makes a psychopath in the 21st century, why not custom make your "True believers" for a Genetic uplift group to be psychopaths who will do anything for the group? People who don't identify other people as anything more important than a box of electronics, and could easily do whatever would be needed, without hesitation.
******
RFC said "refitting a Beowulfan SD to Manticoran standards would be just as difficult as refitting a standard SLN SD to those standards. In other words, it would be cheaper and faster to build new ships."
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Re: [Spoiler - UH] utube snippet
Post by JohnRoth   » Wed Jan 10, 2018 1:28 pm

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Theemile wrote:
JohnRoth wrote:
There's a substantial difference there. The way the pleasure slaves were treated was intended to break them. The GAUL's training would be exactly the opposite: deadly fighters who are carefully conditioned to have serious tunnel vision for their mission. They're basically portrayed as the death of the party.

The reason for breaking pleasure slaves before selling them is to insure that they won't have the self-confidence to do to their eventual masters what they richly deserve. Even so, they're still very dangerous property.

(I've seen nothing to suggest that Jeremy X was subjected to the same treatment.)

We've seen at least two people in the same general mold as pleasure slaves, and neither of them seemed to be particularly oppressed. Quite the opposite.


Why stop at training, why could the GAULS not be a specific genetic mix? We're already looking for the markers for what makes a psychopath in the 21st century, why not custom make your "True believers" for a Genetic uplift group to be psychopaths who will do anything for the group? People who don't identify other people as anything more important than a box of electronics, and could easily do whatever would be needed, without hesitation.


Could very well be - we've seen several different "designer genomes" from the MAlign, so why not that?
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Re: [Spoiler - UH] utube snippet
Post by cthia   » Wed Jan 10, 2018 2:15 pm

cthia
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Theemile wrote:
JohnRoth wrote:
There's a substantial difference there. The way the pleasure slaves were treated was intended to break them. The GAUL's training would be exactly the opposite: deadly fighters who are carefully conditioned to have serious tunnel vision for their mission. They're basically portrayed as the death of the party.

The reason for breaking pleasure slaves before selling them is to insure that they won't have the self-confidence to do to their eventual masters what they richly deserve. Even so, they're still very dangerous property.

(I've seen nothing to suggest that Jeremy X was subjected to the same treatment.)

We've seen at least two people in the same general mold as pleasure slaves, and neither of them seemed to be particularly oppressed. Quite the opposite.
JohnRoth wrote:Why stop at training, why could the GAULS not be a specific genetic mix? We're already looking for the markers for what makes a psychopath in the 21st century, why not custom make your "True believers" for a Genetic uplift group to be psychopaths who will do anything for the group? People who don't identify other people as anything more important than a box of electronics, and could easily do whatever would be needed, without hesitation.


Could very well be - we've seen several different "designer genomes" from the MAlign, so why not that?


Why? Because psychopathy is unstable and uncontrollable, even by the psychopath himself -- hence psychopathic. Can you really expect a psychopath to have a handle on it? The Malign are smart enough to recognize this fact. Remember, as I stated upstream, the Bardasano gene is a known psychopathic killer that was meant to be culled.

You can't count on a psychopath to be anything other than a psychopath.

"You knew I was a psychopath before you signed me up."

Anyone who would intentionally introduce psychopathy into their operations is more psychopathic than the psychopath.

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
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