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Uncompromising Honor, Snippet #3

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Re: Uncompromising Honor, Snippet #3
Post by JohnRoth   » Fri Sep 15, 2017 4:36 pm

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Brigade XO wrote:So Cachalot is to become a sacrifice of an independent system to serve as a warning to anybody who is currently or thinking about trading with Manticore and Beowulf.

Can't SLN see where where this is going to bite them in the ass? Not the least of there problems is the sieve that is SLN planning and intelligence through which the information about Fillerta was passed to Beowulf. Does SLN have any idea that happend- might big indication was the RMN fleet that just happened to be waiting stealth to suppor the BSD fleet that was WAITING for the SLN fleet to move against the Sigma Daconis terminus who's commander seemed very well aquaited with what the SLN was about to do, why etc.


Actually, the information wasn't passed to Beowulf through clandestine channels - it was given to them by an Admiral who was tasked by her higher-ups to get Beowulf on board.


Brigade XO wrote:Actually, this sounds VERY MUCH like an Alignment plan being put into practice to 1) destroy more of the industrial base of anything in and around the SL, not just SL capasity and 2) drive other systems (in and out of the League) further from assisting the SLN in its new war.
Conduct a terror campaing to make them afraid to step out of line and seemingly do it without any warning.

It's a bit early but since Manticore, Beowulf, Erwhon, certainly Maya and perhaps to a lesser extent Haven and the Aldermani probably know where 90% of the actual SLN bases and OFS/FF logistics centers are, and a very detailed list of where the locations are can be built and acted on. It could now be prudent to go clean them out with deep raids. Leave ALL the civilian stuff alone- just kill every SLN ship and SLN orbital platform at those locations. Given the standoff range of the modern GA weapons, the GA assalt forces probably don't even have to close to the SLN's missile weapon engagement ranges. Of course, that is going to kill a lot of people, primarily SLN crew and contractors and further reduce the ability of any of the SL to hold together or compel compiance from both members and non-members alike. And the Alighment thinks this is just fine. They don't need the "normals" who are going to be relplaced anyway.

Technodyne and the Yelden (spelling?) system which essentialy a corporate manufacturing center. Just how many GA capital ships, comming out of hyper at various points around the system (and then being able to talk together with RMN FTL communications) does it take to devastate the Technodyne yards, administration facilities and, almost as an after thought, destroy every SLN warship, freighter plus all lthe Techodyne in-system and any hyper-capable ships (warships/secuirty) and lighters.
How does the SL bureaucracy like looseing perhaps 50% of your current warship and weapons. construction plus workforce and primary source of spair parts. And all that graft they were getting. You can just think of it as one less place you have to try and defend with those deathtraps you call warships.


Yildun does not have any habitable planets. Everything is in orbital habitats. I suspect it might not be all that easy to separate Technodyne facilities from unassociated civilian facilities. Although, since Yildun has a major wormhole junction, I've wondered why it wasn't rolled up with Lacöon 2.

Brigade XO wrote:Attacking neutrals preemptively? The GA wants to Trade, the SL demands they are going to own you.....That is going to smash them in the face.
How long before any SLN ship becomes something almost anybody is going to want to try and kill out of self preservation? The SLN is already loosing warships ships like clay pigeons get smashed at a skeet tournament.
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Re: Uncompromising Honor, Snippet #3
Post by aairfccha   » Fri Sep 15, 2017 4:50 pm

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Brigade XO wrote:So Cachalot is to become a sacrifice of an independent system to serve as a warning to anybody who is currently or thinking about trading with Manticore and Beowulf.

Can't SLN see where where this is going to bite them in the ass?

Especially what happens if one of those targets decides to stop playing by the rules and arranges to extend Lake Michigan a little, covertly or open...
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Re: Uncompromising Honor, Snippet #3
Post by ldwechsler   » Fri Sep 15, 2017 5:30 pm

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aairfccha wrote:
Brigade XO wrote:So Cachalot is to become a sacrifice of an independent system to serve as a warning to anybody who is currently or thinking about trading with Manticore and Beowulf.

Can't SLN see where where this is going to bite them in the ass?



What happens if a ship leaving does not play by the rules? Let's say a merchant ship defies the fleet and takes off. Do they fire at it? If they blow it up, they will have killed citizens of the League.

At that point, the Admiral can never go near that planet and might well be a topic of discussion at any kind of peace talks. And from what I read, this planet is friendly with Beowulf and has not taken steps to leave. They are attacking their own people.
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Re: Uncompromising Honor, Snippet #3
Post by Loren Pechtel   » Fri Sep 15, 2017 7:52 pm

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TangoLima wrote:I have noticed that the SLN is mainly focused on
Maticore as the enemy,
When will the news of the GA reach the SLN ?


They already know--it was announced at the battle of Manticore.
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Re: Uncompromising Honor, Snippet #3
Post by cthia   » Fri Sep 15, 2017 8:38 pm

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I wonder how close Technodyne is in delivering a multidrive missile. How long have they been working on it? How long did it take Manticore to develop it?

A time comparison of the two after Technodyne delivers might shed some insight on the speed of which the SLN can deploy new tech from the ground up.

And... how far will its presence go in giving them a real chance at a successful raiding strategy? And survival? The SLN seems to be willing to bet all of its eggs on the development of one missile.

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
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Re: Uncompromising Honor, Snippet #3
Post by kzt   » Fri Sep 15, 2017 9:01 pm

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JohnRoth wrote:
Yildun does not have any habitable planets. Everything is in orbital habitats. I suspect it might not be all that easy to separate Technodyne facilities from unassociated civilian facilities. Although, since Yildun has a major wormhole junction, I've wondered why it wasn't rolled up with Lacöon 2.

It's likely to be very heavily defended by 2 stage missiles organized in an intelligent framework. You would probably need a major fleet and some time to reduce it without taking heavy casualties. And even then you might take serious casualties. Technodyne HAS been paying attention to what has been going on in the Haven sector and there are clever things you can do with thousands (or perhaps hundreds of thousands) of missile pods.
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Re: Uncompromising Honor, Snippet #3
Post by feyhunde   » Fri Sep 15, 2017 9:35 pm

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kzt wrote:
JohnRoth wrote:
Yildun does not have any habitable planets. Everything is in orbital habitats. I suspect it might not be all that easy to separate Technodyne facilities from unassociated civilian facilities. Although, since Yildun has a major wormhole junction, I've wondered why it wasn't rolled up with Lacöon 2.

It's likely to be very heavily defended by 2 stage missiles organized in an intelligent framework. You would probably need a major fleet and some time to reduce it without taking heavy casualties. And even then you might take serious casualties. Technodyne HAS been paying attention to what has been going on in the Haven sector and there are clever things you can do with thousands (or perhaps hundreds of thousands) of missile pods.



I fell like Yildun is the obvious way the MAlin back channels to Darius get ground since the MAlin has access to all this stuff there's obvious records and bread crumbs to MAlin transshipment points for
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Re: Uncompromising Honor, Snippet #3
Post by phillies   » Fri Sep 15, 2017 11:37 pm

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Loren Pechtel wrote:
TangoLima wrote:I have noticed that the SLN is mainly focused on
Maticore as the enemy,
When will the news of the GA reach the SLN ?


They already know--it was announced at the battle of Manticore.


Perhaps the more significant question is when the SLN will figure out that adding Haven to the Grand Alliance matters.
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Re: Uncompromising Honor, Snippet #3
Post by runsforcelery   » Fri Sep 15, 2017 11:56 pm

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phillies wrote:
Loren Pechtel wrote:
They already know--it was announced at the battle of Manticore.


Perhaps the more significant question is when the SLN will figure out that adding Haven to the Grand Alliance matters.



The League and the SLN are well aware of the other members of the Grand Alliance. They are not, however, about to call their enemies the "Grand Alliance" (for obvious egocentric reasons, but also for sound political and psywar reasons) and Public Information almost invariably refers solely to the Manticorans because under their version of the narrative, its all the fault of those rotten Manties --- already resented in many quarters for their intolerable arrogance and economic rapaciousness ---and their bare-fanged imperialism! Think of it as the equivalent of Iran labeling the US the Great Satan and Israel (right their in their frontyard and a much more immediate threat/target) as the Lesser Satan.

Besides, it's primarily the Manties carrying the offensive burden at the moment. Aside from the Second Fleet units dispatched to assist Mike Henke, the vast bulk of the RHN is still home doing system security until Mycroft comes on line or else forming a major component of Grand Fleet, ready to defend the Manticoran Binary System or for relatively quick offensive action via the MWJ and Beowulf. In other words, the SLN really is primarily confronting Manty light units along the warp bridges.

Largely as a result of the above, they are fixated on the superiority of Manticoran tech without realizing that Haven's --- while not quite as good as Manticore's --- will still rip the butt off any SLN force it meets. This can have . . . unfortunate consequences when it thinks about the technology (and the production sites) it needs to neutralize.


"Oh, bother!" said Pooh, as Piglet came back from the dead.
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Re: Uncompromising Honor, Snippet #3
Post by George J. Smith   » Sat Sep 16, 2017 4:33 am

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Manticore knows about the Technodyne involvement in the Malign's shenanigans in the Talbott sector.

Manticore also knows about the longer range missiles Technodyne supplied to Monica and Filaretta

So why hasn't Manticore already taken steps to reduce the threat that Technodyne poses to Manticore, and subsequently the GA?
.
T&R
GJS

A man should live forever, or die in the attempt
Spider Robinson Callahan's Crosstime Saloon (1977) A voice is heard in Ramah
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