Manticore's new immigration policy

munroburton wrote:Ugh.

It's not immigration. Immigration is when something outside comes in - eg Canada or Mexico into USA. What you're talking about is now internal migration - folks moving around the United States between Virginia, North Carolina and New York, for example. It's just that the original three Manticoran 'states' have now become ~55.

The alternative is to limit freedom of movement to workers - the European Union model. This is probably a good 'temporary' measure for as long as the Star Empire's lop-sided constitutional arrangements are sustained(IIRC, the Old Star Kingdom will provide the majority of Imperial legislators for 50 years).

Several decades of bootstrapping those new members up to Manticoran standards should mitigate future immigration levels. It should be borne in mind that there's still plenty of territory in the Manticore Binary System - those three planets have two thirds of Earth's current population. So what if it jumps up another two or three billion over the next half-century?

You have to take prolong into account. With the exception of the original three worlds and San Martin the vast majority of the new worlds populations have not undergone prolong treatment. If Manticore is successful at improving things in the Talbot Cluster the majority of the population in fifty years will have grownup as at the least content members of the Star Empire. After fifty years the Imperial Parliament make up will be proportional representation of the whole empire.

GabrialSagan wrote: .

I will say I had not considered the usefulness of Treecats in this regard but they really do make the ultimate customs and immigration screeners.

Speaking of 'cats and internal movement of citizens. If The People get it in their heads that it would be best to set up clans on as many worlds as possible to mitigate the likelihood of their extinction how well are the people of Talbott and Silisia react to aliens that can read people's minds moving in and settling on their worlds? I am aware of the fact that Treecats cannot actually read people's thoughts, only their feelings, but when you consider some of the deplorables out there who have the franchise, it is not hard to imagine ignorant bigots stirring up a trouble over the matter. And as much trouble as that is going to be, at least Treecats are adorable. What is The Crown going to do when Medusans want to start settling on new worlds and start moving to Rembrant, Montana, or Manticore itself?

Torch was using cats in the second novel, which is how they discovered that Manpower had infiltrated The Ballroom.

I can almost foresee{name???] The sole cat survivor of the clan killed in the Yawata Strike leading another crew of cate to open the first Diplomatic mission on Haven.

Why should Manticore's immigration policy change from what it has always been? t almost needs as many people now as it did after The Plague Years. Certainly The Cluster will want people with some expertise if not capital. Andwhen ids Capital not welcome?

WeirdlyWired wrote:

GabrialSagan wrote: .

I will say I had not considered the usefulness of Treecats in this regard but they really do make the ultimate customs and immigration screeners.

Speaking of 'cats and internal movement of citizens. If The People get it in their heads that it would be best to set up clans on as many worlds as possible to mitigate the likelihood of their extinction how well are the people of Talbott and Silisia react to aliens that can read people's minds moving in and settling on their worlds? I am aware of the fact that Treecats cannot actually read people's thoughts, only their feelings, but when you consider some of the deplorables out there who have the franchise, it is not hard to imagine ignorant bigots stirring up a trouble over the matter. And as much trouble as that is going to be, at least Treecats are adorable. What is The Crown going to do when Medusans want to start settling on new worlds and start moving to Rembrant, Montana, or Manticore itself?

Torch was using cats in the second novel, which is how they discovered that Manpower had infiltrated The Ballroom.

I can almost foresee{name???] The sole cat survivor of the clan killed in the Yawata Strike leading another crew of cate to open the first Diplomatic mission on Haven.

Why should Manticore's immigration policy change from what it has always been? t almost needs as many people now as it did after The Plague Years. Certainly The Cluster will want people with some expertise if not capital. And when is Capital not welcome?

Your talking about Sorrow Singer. I foresee whole clans moving to Haven eventually, IIRC a couple of dozen will accompany Pritchart back according to textev. Also with the RMN permanently stationing ships in the TQ spouses will likely accompany to their new duty stations and as oftentimes those spouses will have job skills that will be needed in the TQ e.g.teachers doctors and nurses. I wouldn't be surprised that the RMN hasn't already forward stationed a hospital ship at places like Spindle and Montana. And don't be surprised that the warships already in TQ aren't conducting hearts and minds medical care in the systems they visit.

WeirdlyWired wrote:

GabrialSagan wrote: .

I will say I had not considered the usefulness of Treecats in this regard but they really do make the ultimate customs and immigration screeners.

Speaking of 'cats and internal movement of citizens. If The People get it in their heads that it would be best to set up clans on as many worlds as possible to mitigate the likelihood of their extinction how well are the people of Talbott and Silisia react to aliens that can read people's minds moving in and settling on their worlds? I am aware of the fact that Treecats cannot actually read people's thoughts, only their feelings, but when you consider some of the deplorables out there who have the franchise, it is not hard to imagine ignorant bigots stirring up a trouble over the matter. And as much trouble as that is going to be, at least Treecats are adorable. What is The Crown going to do when Medusans want to start settling on new worlds and start moving to Rembrant, Montana, or Manticore itself?

Why should Manticore's immigration policy change from what it has always been? t almost needs as many people now as it did after The Plague Years. Certainly The Cluster will want people with some expertise if not capital. Andwhen ids Capital not welcome?

Because their demand for people has increased exponentially. They have several new planets that are grossly underpopulated. Manticore was a mature society that had reached a stable population and until the war with Haven had not felt a serious demand for fresh blood, that need for a larger population was a big reason for annexing Talbott in the first place. To take full advantage of their new territory Manticore is going to need to attract a large number of people from somewhere else to settle and become Manticorans.

I wonder if The Crown will be open to Solarian immigration? Not even Malachai Abruzzi's whole department working overtime could put a positive spin on Solarians choosing to uproot and settle in Manticoran territory.

I must have missed something? I recall the anti-expansion policy running rampant. I don't recall that they officially halted immigration after the Plague Years, I only assumed they quit actively recruiting immigrants. They had no problem with freed slaves immigrating.

The bright spot on the horizon is that this isn't their first rodeo. How did Manticore handle the influx of people from Cerberus? Admittedly, it was comparatively small compared to this, yet policy should have already have been dusted off and in this case makes for mitigating circumstances.

[quote="GabrialSaganI

Snip...

I wonder if The Crown will be open to Solarian immigration? Not even Malachai Abruzzi's whole department working overtime could put a positive spin on Solarians choosing to uproot and settle in Manticoran territory.[/quote]


I'd be quite wary of 5th columnists amongst sollies, they would definitely require a catscan before being accepted.

I'm not sure that this is entirely correct. For one thing, we don't know anything about prolong in Silesia, but the issue there was always misgovernment more than poverty. There's a very good chance that it's already generally available throughout the old Confederacy.

In Talbot, OTOH, we know that it _isn't_ generally available in places like Dresden and Nuncio [Nuncio is a bit grey, really - they clearly aren't accustomed to dealing with recipients, but it's possible that that's due to very recent availability]. In other systems, however, the situation seems to be somewhat different: in Split and and Montana the question never seems to arise, suggesting that it's no longer an issue. Spindle and the members of the RTU probably also have prolong broadly available. In a place like New Tuscany, I'd not be surprised to learn that it's restricted as part of keeping the proles in their proper place, or the oligarchs could have made it available as part of a 'bread and circuses' campaign to keep the volcano dormant.

All of which is a long-winded way of saying that the effect of prolong availability is going to vary a lot more than you seem to think.

pnakasone wrote:
You have to take prolong into account. With the exception of the original three worlds and San Martin the vast majority of the new worlds populations have not undergone prolong treatment. If Manticore is successful at improving things in the Talbot Cluster the majority of the population in fifty years will have grownup as at the least content members of the Star Empire. After fifty years the Imperial Parliament make up will be proportional representation of the whole empire.

cthia wrote:The bright spot on the horizon is that this isn't their first rodeo. How did Manticore handle the influx of people from Cerberus? Admittedly, it was comparatively small compared to this, yet policy should have already have been dusted off and in this case makes for mitigating circumstances.

And all this time I thought Benjamin absorbed Steadholder Harrington's rather illegal personal navy and all of its crew into the Protector's Own, thus averting a showdown with the Keys.

But yeah, they have the experience, all they need to do is update it. The US spends 2 years vetting refugees, more if they come from countries where terrorist organizations are profligate.

WeirdlyWired wrote:I must have missed something? I recall the anti-expansion policy running rampant. I don't recall that they officially halted immigration after the Plague Years, I only assumed they quit actively recruiting immigrants. They had no problem with freed slaves immigrating.

What they stopped was subsidized immigration.