Topic Actions

Topic Search

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 15 guests

Eridani Edict Violation of the most Dismissive Kind...

Join us in talking discussing all things Honor, including (but not limited to) tactics, favorite characters, and book discussions.
Re: Eridani Edict Violation of the most Dismissive Kind...
Post by cthia   » Wed Oct 19, 2016 2:15 pm

cthia
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 11927
Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2014 12:10 pm

cthia wrote:
Weird Harold wrote:Honor as the "only person left that can contain this monster:"

Image


I stand by that too. Not the only person left who may be given the reins, but the only person left standing who can effectively steer this "chicken with its head cut off" once in charge. I think everyone else would yield to her. They would renounce their claim on the throne.
Weird Harold wrote:I think you're avoiding Gahan Wilson's point that the sole survivor -- Royal or otherwise -- is the only winner. In your scenario Honor would rule over a Kingdom of one.

Fresh out of *sighs.* The more generic FCOL will have to suffice.

For Crying Out Loud!



.
Last edited by cthia on Wed Oct 19, 2016 8:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
Top
Re: Eridani Edict Violation of the most Dismissive Kind...
Post by cthia   » Wed Oct 19, 2016 2:32 pm

cthia
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 11927
Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2014 12:10 pm

At least object on the grounds of irreconcilable differences of "vector of concept" ¬ "concept of vector."

That would actually make sense.

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
Top
Re: Eridani Edict Violation of the most Dismissive Kind...
Post by cthia   » Fri Oct 28, 2016 4:12 am

cthia
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 11927
Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2014 12:10 pm

My niece's two cents...

"Uncle, back on the subject of your strike. I think you should mention in the forum that their lack of belief on the grounds that some of them state, borders a little on the absurd.

By their premise, the lives of ~ 5 thousand people would be dictated in such a way that they couldn't all visit Manticore without checking in with someone else in other systems. You cannot do that. It doesn't account for the human element of practicality. You can't just tell everyone to leave the system and don't come back and visit unless by royal or holy proclamation. That is truly absurd. What of funerals? I would imagine that lots of people were at Honor's funeral. And would be at Elizabeth's. And buying stock into the belief that you can dictate the lives of loftily born aristocrats by telling them that their itinerary is subject to invitation is laughable. And across solar systems too? That would totally eliminate the spontaneity of hitching a ride home to your birth planet because "I might be targeted en masse."

Or, you'll reserve those missives of abstinence from functions to a select few. In which case simply makes Anisimovna's job, orders of magnitude easier.

And once one accepts that reality then it suddenly doesn't seem so far fetched that this sort of strike can happen. Except that I, personally, would have made the scenario more plausible by widening the kill zone to include the entire city of Landing. That both removes the onus of responsibility of the MAlign to be so emotionally (and unbelievably) vested and also removes the likely responsibility of the Crown to ensure preservation of the line of succession beyond a reasonable doubt. It is practical to assume the Crown would have a contingency plan in place to ensure that everyone in the line of succession doesn't frequent the same event. But one cannot reasonably apply that to an entire city. Or planet, for that matter.

Even if everyone couldn't attend the several different functions going on in the city, you couldn't reasonably forbid their being in Landing. Then Anisimovna's charge of shepherding wouldn't have been so difficult."

Then she rambled on about where it all ends. Mandating that various members in the line of succession are to occupy varying planets? Varying systems? She also stated that this type scenario, whether by design or by disaster is what the treecats are trying to avoid by relocating to Grayson.

I wonder if they can all be shepherded back into Landing?

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
Top
Re: Eridani Edict Violation of the most Dismissive Kind...
Post by munroburton   » Fri Oct 28, 2016 6:33 am

munroburton
Admiral

Posts: 2094
Joined: Sat Jun 15, 2013 9:16 am
Location: Scotland

I don't think anyone ever said there was a law or proclamation preventing the 5,000 successors getting in the same room. Just that there might be a safeguard practice to keep one or two in a safe bunker should such an event be organised.

As for the argument that the nature and attitudes of Manticore's aristocrats prevents such a declaration from working - well, I think it cuts the other way too. Some of them aren't going to show up simply because they consider themselves too superior to bother, not worthy enough to attend or some sort of spat with Elizabeth or one of the other nobles attending. Example, Catherine Montaigne. Some will be on the Queen's service and with such an event in process, the Navy will be at high alert.

During Honor's "funeral", Elizabeth's brother was at Trevor's Star doing his job as a RMN commander. During the royal heir's wedding, Michelle(and Gwen Archer) was in Talbott, commanding 10th Fleet.

It's much harder for Anisimovna to manipulate those sort of isolated cases. 5,000 Manticoran aristocrats do not run around at her command any more than they do at Elizabeth's - who actually does command some of them.

I made a point about the Harris Assassination earlier in this thread - what I meant was, an EE strike isn't required to accomplish this sort of decapitation strategy. And that even an EE strike would not have gotten all the remaining Legislaturalists, like Parnell or Bergren(who actually remained as Foreign Secretary slash Ambassador to Sol until Pritchart took over!). But that didn't stop the regime from changing anyway, more or less as that attack's masterminds wanted it to.

If the objective is to disrupt Manticoran government, just take out Landing whilst the Parliaments are in session. Make Michelle the queen by default - she's far away and it will take a long time to bring her back for a crowning. Absolutely kill Honor Harrington.

Hell, that would be my first step. Kill Honor, another double state funeral is guaranteed, gathering up most of the notables.
Top
Re: Eridani Edict Violation of the most Dismissive Kind...
Post by cthia   » Fri Oct 28, 2016 9:06 am

cthia
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 11927
Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2014 12:10 pm

munroburton wrote:I don't think anyone ever said there was a law or proclamation preventing the 5,000 successors getting in the same room. Just that there might be a safeguard practice to keep one or two in a safe bunker should such an event be organised.

As for the argument that the nature and attitudes of Manticore's aristocrats prevents such a declaration from working - well, I think it cuts the other way too. Some of them aren't going to show up simply because they consider themselves too superior to bother, not worthy enough to attend or some sort of spat with Elizabeth or one of the other nobles attending. Example, Catherine Montaigne. Some will be on the Queen's service and with such an event in process, the Navy will be at high alert.

During Honor's "funeral", Elizabeth's brother was at Trevor's Star doing his job as a RMN commander. During the royal heir's wedding, Michelle(and Gwen Archer) was in Talbott, commanding 10th Fleet.

It's much harder for Anisimovna to manipulate those sort of isolated cases. 5,000 Manticoran aristocrats do not run around at her command any more than they do at Elizabeth's - who actually does command some of them.

I made a point about the Harris Assassination earlier in this thread - what I meant was, an EE strike isn't required to accomplish this sort of decapitation strategy. And that even an EE strike would not have gotten all the remaining Legislaturalists, like Parnell or Bergren(who actually remained as Foreign Secretary slash Ambassador to Sol until Pritchart took over!). But that didn't stop the regime from changing anyway, more or less as that attack's masterminds wanted it to.

If the objective is to disrupt Manticoran government, just take out Landing whilst the Parliaments are in session. Make Michelle the queen by default - she's far away and it will take a long time to bring her back for a crowning. Absolutely kill Honor Harrington.

Hell, that would be my first step. Kill Honor, another double state funeral is guaranteed, gathering up most of the notables.

What she meant in that regard, is if the nobility has to receive permission ahead of time for in-system itineraries may as well be as such, for all intents and purposes, to an aristocrat's sensibilities.

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
Top
Re: Eridani Edict Violation of the most Dismissive Kind...
Post by Jonathan_S   » Fri Oct 28, 2016 11:45 am

Jonathan_S
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 6335
Joined: Fri Jun 24, 2011 1:01 pm
Location: Virginia, USA

cthia wrote:What she meant in that regard, is if the nobility has to receive permission ahead of time for in-system itineraries may as well be as such, for all intents and purposes, to an aristocrat's sensibilities.

I must have missed it if someone proposed that there would be laws requiring people in the line of succession get prior approval of their travel plans. I could see the Queen, or her security service sometimes requesting specific people close to throne volunteer to stay clear (or if they serve a government post possibly being instructed to stay out of the splatter zone. Shades of the US government picking at least one "designated survivor".

But for the most part there would be no need for even that because plenty of people would already have jobs, schooling, or responsibilities that would keep them away. It would only potentially be an issue for the very largest gatherings like The aforementioned funerals for Honor.
But asking a few people to stay clear is totally different from restricting everybody's right to free travel. As you said there's really no chance that that kind of restriction would fly in a free society like Manticore.
Top
Re: Eridani Edict Violation of the most Dismissive Kind...
Post by cthia   » Wed Nov 02, 2016 3:57 pm

cthia
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 11927
Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2014 12:10 pm

A thought occurred to me. The MAlign has to be worried about the treecats sinking their claws into some of their plans. And the bulk of the treecats are assembled in one specific area on Sphinx that can be targeted by this sort of strike.

Of course, the contingency plan that the cats have adopted of relocating some of them to Grayson will ensure the survival of their species. However, even though the strike won't decimate the entire population, it will certainly back the cats into a corner of having to regroup and reassess their stance. And they would certainly suffer emotionally for quite some time in the aftermath of such a disaster that they may not be able to assist the GA any longer. Or have enough of them to go around.

Is there textev regarding the treecat population on Grayson?

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
Top
Re: Eridani Edict Violation of the most Dismissive Kind...
Post by Vince   » Thu Nov 03, 2016 12:37 am

Vince
Vice Admiral

Posts: 1565
Joined: Fri Apr 09, 2010 10:43 pm

cthia wrote:A thought occurred to me. The MAlign has to be worried about the treecats sinking their claws into some of their plans. And the bulk of the treecats are assembled in one specific area on Sphinx that can be targeted by this sort of strike.

Of course, the contingency plan that the cats have adopted of relocating some of them to Grayson will ensure the survival of their species. However, even though the strike won't decimate the entire population, it will certainly back the cats into a corner of having to regroup and reassess their stance. And they would certainly suffer emotionally for quite some time in the aftermath of such a disaster that they may not be able to assist the GA any longer. Or have enough of them to go around.

Is there textev regarding the treecat population on Grayson?

Treecats live all over Sphinx, wherever picketwood tree systems exist, they aren't concentrated in one area. Most are still living at a hunter-gatherer level (requires small groups scattered over very large amounts of land), and are slowly introducing agricultural practices to how they live. For Grayson, I can't remember if any additional treecats went there after the initial group that Honor provided transportation to in In Enemy Hands.
-------------------------------------------------------------
History does not repeat itself so much as it echoes.
Top
Re: Eridani Edict Violation of the most Dismissive Kind...
Post by Weird Harold   » Thu Nov 03, 2016 1:52 pm

Weird Harold
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 4478
Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2014 9:25 pm
Location: "Lost Wages", NV

Vince wrote:For Grayson, I can't remember if any additional treecats went there after the initial group that Honor provided transportation to in In Enemy Hands.


There is also passing mention of a colony on Gryphon and at Jason Bay, on Manticore. Also, there are all of the treecats sent to Haven and dispersed among the Navies of the GA.
.
.
.
Answers! I got lots of answers!

(Now if I could just find the right questions.)
Top
Re: Eridani Edict Violation of the most Dismissive Kind...
Post by cthia   » Thu Nov 03, 2016 4:24 pm

cthia
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 11927
Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2014 12:10 pm

Thanks for the info guys. I was under the impression that all treecats on Sphinx were pretty much contained in a wooded picketwood area however many square miles. Totally away from humans and secluded. But now I remember that Honor hiked to Nimitz' clan, iirc. Which couldn't have been as remote as I was thinking, if she hiked there.


Wasn't aware there were any on the other planets mentioned. I bet they really miss the picketwood if they were initially on Sphinx.

Treecats born on other planets should get to visit Sphinx, just for the picketwood experience. So they'll know what the memory songs that included mention of them are all about.

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
Top

Return to Honorverse