Topic Actions

Topic Search

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 6 guests

Eridani Edict Violation of the most Dismissive Kind...

Join us in talking discussing all things Honor, including (but not limited to) tactics, favorite characters, and book discussions.
Re: Eridani Edict Violation of the most Dismissive Kind...
Post by cthia   » Fri Oct 07, 2016 2:21 pm

cthia
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 11274
Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2014 12:10 pm

cthia wrote:
crewdude48 wrote:There is no way to do what you want and still leave Manticore a Star nation. Considering the level of technology and record keeping they have had since the formation of the Kingdom, they would be able to track down that accountant on Beowoulf who is Elizabeth's 14th cousin twice removed. (Ever seen King Ralph?)

Furthermore, considering that they have been at war, or preparing for war, for as long as they have been, they most likely fallow something similar to the "designated survivor" protocols that the US government fallows.

Assuming that Honor is the only survivor of every title of nobility, she could probably assert a claim of Queen, but the level of devastation required to get to that means that her subjects would be only a few thousand battered and dying people.
My bold to call attention.

I don't recall Detweiler requesting that that be a prerequisite, nor can I ever imagine — even in my wildest meanderings — that Detty'd even care.
crewdude48 wrote:You were the one who requested that prerequisite. In order for Honor to become Queen, there needs to be something for her to be queen of.


Why wouldn't there be something for Honor to be Queen of, in at least the least sense? (MAlign humor.) Again, this was a precision strike at the coronary artery of the government's. Only!

The planet will still be there, along with its infrastructure. And 99.9999 percent of the population will still be there. The only people killed were the only people targeted — military targets. This was a humane EE violation, if there really is such a thing. It was certainly one that was metered. What do you know, in a strange turn of events, innocent bystanders were not a part of some piss-ant explanation of collateral damage for a change. And just perhaps, just maybe, these are MAlign seeds of goodwill sown towards its enemies. It is the same message that Honor sent Theisman, that Theisman accepted and reciprocated...

"We are willing to exercise restraint. But we don't have to."

Yet in this case, the message and example goes out as a warning to the rest of the galaxy. The lesson is too late for Manticore. You don't survive a direct lesson in "Advanced MA EE Strikes" - Anisimovna.

You should preorder her book. And the companion "Leveraging the Kill." (Available for preorder on the "Honorverse Bestseller List" soon). Manticore should have read their reading assignment. And just like the Havenites' own disadvantage of not being able to conceptually read the obvious implications of Apollo, so too it is with the Manticorans and MAlign technology.

"We rewrote the book on EEV."

****** *

I understand some of you being appalled. Contemplation of such a complete and utter loss of key figures is like a blow to the stomach. I think what offends, if we're honest with ourselves and strip away all of the fake ablative armor, is the mere sobering of the very reality that it could happen.

It is like being caught in the deer-lights of possibility. Stuck, frozen. Immobile. Maybe even gripped with fear. And the anger that occurs along with simply a natural, yet illogical reflex action.

No one thought that the Battle of Manticore would happen, let alone the Second Battle. This thing I've laid out could happen. The implication of the "balance of power tipping technology" invites this scenario to the party. Anisimova is the Salamander's counterpart, and just like the Salamander, she also doesn't think that the surface of the strategic possibilities of their technology has even been scratched. The development of Apollo hasn't cornered the market on that.

The complete and utter stealth of MAlign tech moves EE violation capability into a new realm. Gone are the need for the crude and rude swarmings of a planet with saturating projectiles. The MA has designed weaponry to complement this new turn in warfare -- completely scientific, specialized computer controlled planetary bombardments offering optimum rewards meted out in precise surgical strikes. One of the bottlenecks in this "precision strike" MAlign tech was, surprisingly, the computer's software. They've got state of the art computers but software designers had fallen behind writing code for these beasts. Whose job is to accomplish only one thing. Completely Surgical and Precision Planetary Strikes. (CSAPPS)

These computers would analyze every ship in space, TVs (Threat Vectors) and their programmed reaction times and ability to intercept. (The MAlign have been sitting and watching.) These powerful computers would produce the vectors of optimum launch, producing this (CSAPPS) acronym for the named strike — as a factor of the hot, tree-like sap that is found from the melted debris at the sites of these strikes prompting them to become humorously known in MAlign parlance as Sap Suckers.



Edit: good will, goodwill

.
Last edited by cthia on Fri Oct 07, 2016 5:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
Top
Re: Eridani Edict Violation of the most Dismissive Kind...
Post by Weird Harold   » Fri Oct 07, 2016 2:39 pm

Weird Harold
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 4467
Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2014 9:25 pm
Location: "Lost Wages", NV

cthia wrote:The planet will still be there, along with its infrastructure. And 99.9999 percent of the population will still be there. The only people killed were the only people targeted — military targets.


If that is true, Honor can't be Queen. You can't have a functional Empire and Honor as Queen. They are two exclusive results -- XOR not OR.
.
.
.
Answers! I got lots of answers!

(Now if I could just find the right questions.)
Top
Re: Eridani Edict Violation of the most Dismissive Kind...
Post by cthia   » Fri Oct 07, 2016 4:57 pm

cthia
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 11274
Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2014 12:10 pm

Weird Harold wrote:
cthia wrote:The planet will still be there, along with its infrastructure. And 99.9999 percent of the population will still be there. The only people killed were the only people targeted — military targets.


If that is true, Honor can't be Queen. You can't have a functional Empire and Honor as Queen. They are two exclusive results -- XOR not OR.

Why not? Care to elucidate? If a similar fate befell the US and all else being equal — wouldn't simply a copy of The US Constitution promise survival?

Besides, cannot the remnants of this mess decide on their own what shall be their fate and who they'd like to carry on from there -- in an emergency? A catastrophic emergency that is threatening to kill the Manticore?

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
Top
Re: Eridani Edict Violation of the most Dismissive Kind...
Post by Weird Harold   » Fri Oct 07, 2016 5:03 pm

Weird Harold
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 4467
Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2014 9:25 pm
Location: "Lost Wages", NV

cthia wrote:If that is true, Honor can't be Queen. You can't have a functional Empire and Honor as Queen. They are two exclusive results -- XOR not OR.

Why not? Care to elucidate? [/quote]

Honor is too far down the line of succession. G.W.E.N Archer is ahead of her and unlikely to be at a "Winton Family Gathering."

Honor might make it as part of a regency council, but before she could become Queen, you'd have to kill off one, if not both, of her spouses (who are ahead of her in the succession) along with half or more of the RMN officer corp.
.
.
.
Answers! I got lots of answers!

(Now if I could just find the right questions.)
Top
Re: Eridani Edict Violation of the most Dismissive Kind...
Post by cthia   » Fri Oct 07, 2016 5:58 pm

cthia
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 11274
Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2014 12:10 pm

Weird Harold wrote:
cthia wrote:If that is true, Honor can't be Queen. You can't have a functional Empire and Honor as Queen. They are two exclusive results -- XOR not OR.

cthia wrote:Why not? Care to elucidate?


Honor is too far down the line of succession. G.W.E.N Archer is ahead of her and unlikely to be at a "Winton Family Gathering."

Honor might make it as part of a regency council, but before she could become Queen, you'd have to kill off one, if not both, of her spouses (who are ahead of her in the succession) along with half or more of the RMN officer corp.

Can I borrow a *sigh* from someone? I'm experiencing a shortage.

Gwen Archer is dead. He wanted to come home for this event as well. He came home when word of Michelle going home reached him. I see I have to attempt to supply a plausible reason that they all came home. Many are having trouble accepting the premise of the thread and proceeding from there. It happened people. The MAlign are as astounded as you are. But they are still dancing a jig.

Perhaps Michelle was to be proposed to and an offer of marriage right on the spot was to follow spearheaded by another one of Elizabeth's orchestrated type of shotgun weddings similar to what was pulled on Honor. Honor had her hand in this as well, as payback. We don't know that Michelle wasn't in love on the side and hid it from most everyone else because of the delicacy of the union. Perhaps it's an Andermani? And everyone wants to be there to tease her and to see it for themselves. And Elizabeth, ever wanting to kill two political birds with one stone was up to something, politically. Fifth in line for succession and marrying an Andermani commoner has the political overtones and potential of being big.

Besides, this is the biggest most popular family reunion of them all and many were naturally invited for various reasons known only to the Crown.

I don't deny that protocol across the board had been broken. But this is a sentimental event coinciding with a political move only Elizabeth and a select few knew of. A temporary replacement was sent out to Michelle to relieve her for this honor. And don't think for a moment that Elizabeth failed to reprimand many that were at the function that shouldn't have been there. Yet, in the heat of the moment and the sentimental human element, "Oh what the hell."

The problem again, was the human element. Such an event bent the grapevine from its weight. Communications' channels were abused, laxed. This is an exciting time that flooded even the most unusual communications channels with activity. The MA had informants.

When word of such a gathering and grapevine bending event radiated all the way across the galaxy and reached Anisimovna's ears, I can imagine the conversation she had with Detweiler...

"You mean we can get the government and many in line for succession?"

"Yes. So many are rumored to be going home, that we could very well hit the lottery."

"So this is the opportunity you've been waiting for? This is ripe for your "Operation Dismiss?"

"It promises to be the stuff of legends."


Aside:
By the way. Honor was en route as well, along with Benjamin. They barely missed the fun by the sound of Tester's gun.

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
Top
Re: Eridani Edict Violation of the most Dismissive Kind...
Post by Weird Harold   » Fri Oct 07, 2016 8:00 pm

Weird Harold
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 4467
Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2014 9:25 pm
Location: "Lost Wages", NV

cthia wrote:"You mean we can get the government and many in line for succession?"


I think you are severely underestimating the size of the Winton succession chain, and overestimating Honor's (non)place in it.

I would guess that a majority of those born into the Manticoran Nobility rank ahead of Honor in the line of succession. Many of those wouldn't attend a Winton family function unless you put them in shackles and chains to physically carry them there.
.
.
.
Answers! I got lots of answers!

(Now if I could just find the right questions.)
Top
Re: Eridani Edict Violation of the most Dismissive Kind...
Post by cthia   » Fri Oct 07, 2016 8:52 pm

cthia
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 11274
Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2014 12:10 pm

Weird Harold wrote:
cthia wrote:"You mean we can get the government and many in line for succession?"


I think you are severely underestimating the size of the Winton succession chain, and overestimating Honor's (non)place in it.

I would guess that a majority of those born into the Manticoran Nobility rank ahead of Honor in the line of succession. Many of those wouldn't attend a Winton family function unless you put them in shackles and chains to physically carry them there.
Yep. Yet those stodgy old fellows did that day. Believe it or not, they were actually having fun. And had promised to do it again. Perhaps turn over a new leaf and make it a habit as was the promise of that same old stale, New Year's Resolution.

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
Top
Re: Eridani Edict Violation of the most Dismissive Kind...
Post by cthia   » Fri Oct 07, 2016 9:10 pm

cthia
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 11274
Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2014 12:10 pm

It amazes me how much alike Anisimovna and Honor are. Aldona is exactly what she would be, if Honor had been born an Alpha.

Also as the Salamander's counterpart, it was suggested as praise to Anisimovna, "You must have meticulously planned it beforehand and knew full-well that we were going to get such a slate wiping strike!"

Much as Honor allowed her bridge to think she knew Theisman would flinch first and break off against her death ride. So too did Anisimovna, "I'll just allow them their fantasy."

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
Top
Re: Eridani Edict Violation of the most Dismissive Kind...
Post by Potato   » Fri Oct 07, 2016 9:43 pm

Potato
Captain of the List

Posts: 469
Joined: Wed Apr 21, 2010 8:27 pm

Then Parliament gets together and selects a new line from the senior Lords to be the monarch. Oh, but wait, you said that you are killing them too! Then Parliament goes and selects the second senior. Oh, but you are killing them too! Then Parliament goes and selects the third senior. Oh, but you are killing them too!

Do you understand just how absurd this sounds? You are killing everyone ahead of Honor, and their families! They are not all going to magically be in one place! Hell, all of Congress and their families are not in one place ever. But your magical "surgical" strike is going to take them all out? Bullshit. Hence I agree with Weird Harold's point: if the strike is big enough to get all the possible people ahead of Honor, then it must have devastated all the planets in the Manticore system and there is no more Star Empire; otherwise this attack is "small" enough that many people missed it. It cannot be both.
Top
Re: Eridani Edict Violation of the most Dismissive Kind...
Post by cthia   » Fri Oct 07, 2016 10:59 pm

cthia
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 11274
Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2014 12:10 pm

Potato wrote:Then Parliament gets together and selects a new line from the senior Lords to be the monarch. Oh, but wait, you said that you are killing them too! Then Parliament goes and selects the second senior. Oh, but you are killing them too! Then Parliament goes and selects the third senior. Oh, but you are killing them too!

Do you understand just how absurd this sounds? You are killing everyone ahead of Honor, and their families! They are not all going to magically be in one place! Hell, all of Congress and their families are not in one place ever. But your magical "surgical" strike is going to take them all out? Bullshit. Hence I agree with Weird Harold's point: if the strike is big enough to get all the possible people ahead of Honor, then it must have devastated all the planets in the Manticore system and there is no more Star Empire; otherwise this attack is "small" enough that many people missed it. It cannot be both.

Referring to the premise of the thread as bullshit does not represent "a modicum of decorum" yet has thus far failed to bring out the Duckk.

So, pump your brakes Tater. Your fries are about to burn.

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
Top

Return to Honorverse