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Last use for SL SD captured

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Re: Last use for SL SD captured
Post by JohnRoth   » Wed May 17, 2017 7:49 pm

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cthia wrote:Unless there is something that can be done to disable the ships until further notice.


Weird Harold wrote:Adm Gold Peak "triggered the security meltdown" (owtte) on all but one survivor of Adm Bing's task force. That slagged the computer systems, making the ships entirely inoperable until the computers were repaired and reprogrammed.

Of course that would require towing anything given back to the SLN -- unless you waited until you arrived in Earth orbit before slagging the computers. :mrgreen:


cthia wrote:Um, Harold. I think "driving" them back to Solly space would fall under the heading of an even worse idea. If you are taking them back it will be without weapons. So you have quite a bit of your needed manpower sitting naked in the bowels of worthless Solly junk. And even if you have adequate escort, it isn't going to help the many souls trapped inside the bowels of Solly junk when the MA's round two goes into effect...


He said "towing," not "driving." Without those computers, the ships are not going anywhere without a tow, so there's no reason to have anyone on board. Even assuming that the life support would work without some of that computer support.

The obvious thing to do is to just drop them into an orbit somewhere around Neptune, and then tell the Sollies approximately where you left them.
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Re: Last use for SL SD captured
Post by JohnRoth   » Wed May 17, 2017 7:58 pm

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After a bit too much of something that will not be named, I realized the ideal thing to do with those SDs.

Use them for vacuum snooker (pool on this side of the pond.) Each player has a tug with a tractor, and can impart a strictly limited delta V to the "cue" SD. Each player has a maximum of 5 minutes to plan cis shot, unless it takes longer for cis tug to get to the "cue" SD, in which case ce has only 1 minute to put a tractor on it and fling it somewhere.

The perfect game for idle younger sons who are looking for something to spend daddy's money on.
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Re: Last use for SL SD captured
Post by Weird Harold   » Wed May 17, 2017 8:01 pm

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JohnRoth wrote:He said "towing," not "driving." Without those computers, the ships are not going anywhere without a tow, so there's no reason to have anyone on board. Even assuming that the life support would work without some of that computer support.


I think cthia was referring the option of "drive them there and then slag the computers." Of course, slagging the computer would render any missiles aboard useless as well, there's no reason to remove them for the ferry ride.

Either option is really more attention than the scrap-yard queens deserve. :lol:
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Answers! I got lots of answers!

(Now if I could just find the right questions.)
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Re: Last use for SL SD captured
Post by cthia   » Wed May 17, 2017 8:02 pm

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JohnRoth wrote:
cthia wrote:Unless there is something that can be done to disable the ships until further notice.


Weird Harold wrote:Adm Gold Peak "triggered the security meltdown" (owtte) on all but one survivor of Adm Bing's task force. That slagged the computer systems, making the ships entirely inoperable until the computers were repaired and reprogrammed.

Of course that would require towing anything given back to the SLN -- unless you waited until you arrived in Earth orbit before slagging the computers. :mrgreen:


cthia wrote:Um, Harold. I think "driving" them back to Solly space would fall under the heading of an even worse idea. If you are taking them back it will be without weapons. So you have quite a bit of your needed manpower sitting naked in the bowels of worthless Solly junk. And even if you have adequate escort, it isn't going to help the many souls trapped inside the bowels of Solly junk when the MA's round two goes into effect...


He said "towing," not "driving." Without those computers, the ships are not going anywhere without a tow, so there's no reason to have anyone on board. Even assuming that the life support would work without some of that computer support.

The obvious thing to do is to just drop them into an orbit somewhere around Neptune, and then tell the Sollies approximately where you left them.

I simply disregarded the "towing" option because of the logistics of acquiring that many tugs unless the RMN wants to subject themselves to an endless string of trips to Solly space using tugs that they probably need in the Home system.

PLUS! The BIG RED BUTTON works on tugs as well. Even better to cause a ruckus.

Personally I think the RMN should steer clear of the Solly system and not give the MA a chance to engineer another frame-up. Unless they are there to shoot something.

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
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Re: Last use for SL SD captured
Post by cthia   » Wed May 17, 2017 8:04 pm

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Weird Harold wrote:
JohnRoth wrote:He said "towing," not "driving." Without those computers, the ships are not going anywhere without a tow, so there's no reason to have anyone on board. Even assuming that the life support would work without some of that computer support.


I think cthia was referring the option of "drive them there and then slag the computers." Of course, slagging the computer would render any missiles aboard useless as well, there's no reason to remove them for the ferry ride.

Either option is really more attention than the scrap-yard queens deserve. :lol:

Yep, guilty as charged.

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
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Re: Last use for SL SD captured
Post by Jonathan_S   » Wed May 17, 2017 8:40 pm

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cthia wrote:I've got a nagging suspicion that this notion falls under the heading of a very bad idea. It conjures up flashbacks of the predicament Alfredo Yu found himself in while at the helm of Saladin. After you make the exchange of all of those captured ships (possibly with as many warm bodies needed to more than just steer the darn things), what is stopping them from turning around at some point and attacking you again with those same ships -- refueled, restocked and repaired, with reinforecements that have benefit of upgrades and the fact that they now have the tactical knowledge born of experience and a do over?

I'll assume that the missiles have been removed, but if you're going through the trouble of returning the ships I'll imagine you didn't trash them. Bit of a problem tearing into them anyways. But what is stopping them from planning for the entire ordeal and bringing several fleet trains and a fleet of repair ships and stashing them somewhere awaiting a rendezvous?

Recall any one of the old movies where there is this type of an exchange and the touchy hair-trigger moments that are dangerous and nerve-racking where each party backs away from each other keeping an eye on any sudden movements. How long to replace PDLCs or whatever innards the RMN may rip out -- still leaving the ships "operable?"

Unless there is something that can be done to disable the ships until further notice.

What am I missing?

I don't think gesture of returning the ships is worth any effort, but we're told that retrofitting SLN SDs into half decent ships is significantly more time, effort, and resources than building a clean-sheet SD(P) design. So it's a benefit to the RMN and the Grand Alliance if the SLN was tempted into attempting to turn those obsolete junkers into ships that were combat effective in the modern MDM combat environment. (Same reason the RMN doesn't want to blow up the SLN reserve)

Now unlike most of the Reserve, if you didn't disable the ships before the SLN took possession they'd be perfectly capable of being used against members attempting to succeed from the League - enough of them could overcome any likely tactical superiority of even the most large and modern SDFs [size=70[(and remember than maybe as many as 5 or 6 SDFs may even have wallers at all)[/size]
So handing them back, intact, might let the League force members to hang together - so another reason not to hand them back.

But purely against the RMN anything that tempts to SLN to try to refit and upgrade Scientists and Vegas is an advantage for Manticore.
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Re: Last use for SL SD captured
Post by cthia   » Wed May 17, 2017 9:20 pm

cthia
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Jonathan_S wrote:
cthia wrote:I've got a nagging suspicion that this notion falls under the heading of a very bad idea. It conjures up flashbacks of the predicament Alfredo Yu found himself in while at the helm of Saladin. After you make the exchange of all of those captured ships (possibly with as many warm bodies needed to more than just steer the darn things), what is stopping them from turning around at some point and attacking you again with those same ships -- refueled, restocked and repaired, with reinforecements that have benefit of upgrades and the fact that they now have the tactical knowledge born of experience and a do over?

I'll assume that the missiles have been removed, but if you're going through the trouble of returning the ships I'll imagine you didn't trash them. Bit of a problem tearing into them anyways. But what is stopping them from planning for the entire ordeal and bringing several fleet trains and a fleet of repair ships and stashing them somewhere awaiting a rendezvous?

Recall any one of the old movies where there is this type of an exchange and the touchy hair-trigger moments that are dangerous and nerve-racking where each party backs away from each other keeping an eye on any sudden movements. How long to replace PDLCs or whatever innards the RMN may rip out -- still leaving the ships "operable?"

Unless there is something that can be done to disable the ships until further notice.

What am I missing?

I don't think gesture of returning the ships is worth any effort, but we're told that retrofitting SLN SDs into half decent ships is significantly more time, effort, and resources than building a clean-sheet SD(P) design. So it's a benefit to the RMN and the Grand Alliance if the SLN was tempted into attempting to turn those obsolete junkers into ships that were combat effective in the modern MDM combat environment. (Same reason the RMN doesn't want to blow up the SLN reserve)

Now unlike most of the Reserve, if you didn't disable the ships before the SLN took possession they'd be perfectly capable of being used against members attempting to succeed from the League - enough of them could overcome any likely tactical superiority of even the most large and modern SDFs [size=70[(and remember than maybe as many as 5 or 6 SDFs may even have wallers at all)[/size]
So handing them back, intact, might let the League force members to hang together - so another reason not to hand them back.

But purely against the RMN anything that tempts to SLN to try to refit and upgrade Scientists and Vegas is an advantage for Manticore.

Then this poor "Johnny come lately," is in error on quite a few things. I sincerely hate it when he does that. My apologies in advance.

Just how many ships are we talking about returning? Tugs cannot tow them in series can they? Tugs are not hyper capable are they? So they are going to have to travel a few long, time consuming legs. Also, I was under the impression that the availability of tugs is limited in the Home system.

I wouldn't think that the RMN would want to export that many tugs for foreign duty, just to assist sorry ass Sollies. Tugs that they may need to shortstop orbital debris if they are attacked again. I'm going to go out on a limb and say that MO now demands that the RMN keep as many tugs around the Home system as possible.

:Case of Emergency, as in unscheduled Malignant behavior!

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
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Re: Last use for SL SD captured
Post by kzt   » Wed May 17, 2017 11:25 pm

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They can come and pick them up.
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Re: Last use for SL SD captured
Post by cthia   » Thu May 18, 2017 11:18 am

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kzt wrote:They can come and pick them up.

Which leads right back to my initial post.

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
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Re: Last use for SL SD captured
Post by cthia   » Thu May 18, 2017 11:43 am

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Weird Harold wrote:
JohnRoth wrote:He said "towing," not "driving." Without those computers, the ships are not going anywhere without a tow, so there's no reason to have anyone on board. Even assuming that the life support would work without some of that computer support.


I think cthia was referring the option of "drive them there and then slag the computers." Of course, slagging the computer would render any missiles aboard useless as well, there's no reason to remove them for the ferry ride.

Either option is really more attention than the scrap-yard queens deserve. :lol:

My "Johnny come lately syndrome" is acting up again Harold. Apologies.

Slagging the computers wouldn't permanently disable the missiles would they? If not, then why would that not fall under the heading of a very bad idea as well? It would be ironic to be on a ship destroyed by a missile that you returned.

I can actually hear the insolent, arrogant Solly rat-b*stards about to deliver a payload to some unsuspecting RMN ship...

"Thanks for returning these missiles you idiots, but we really feel that you oughta have them!"

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
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