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Court dress in the Kingdom of Manticore -request for data

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Re: Court dress in the Kingdom of Manticore -request for dat
Post by roseandheather   » Thu Jul 31, 2014 6:58 pm

roseandheather
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Location: Republic of Haven

Neitz wrote:
tpope wrote:Interestingly enough, this just came up in a discussion on our Facebook page. Here's what Thomas Marrone came up with a few years back:

https://www.facebook.com/48880203114159 ... 58/?type=1


And to add to that, some textev describing Court Dress:

Justin fastened the cufflinks and straightened the lace front of the boy's dress shirt. When King Roger I had become the first monarch of the Kingdom of Manticore, he had commissioned an artist to design court dress. His only dictums had been that the new attire would be comfortable, elegant, and equally suited for male or female wear.

The artist had done his work brilliantly, Justin thought as he helped Michael into his jacket. The tail coat worn over tailored trousers had been borrowed from ancient England. The ruffled shirt with its lace cuffs had been taken from a slightly earlier time. There was no hat to create awkward clutter, and the footwear consisted of low-heeled boots that looked elegant while permitting the wearer to stand comfortably for hours.

By tradition, each noble house had its garb tailored in colors corresponding to those of its family's crest—in the case of the Wintons dusky blue trimmed with silver, although the Queen wore the red and gold of the Star Kingdom of Manticore. Awards, marriage alliances, and the like were indicated by slim bands at the cuffs. Since tradition also dictated that the fabrics be sumptuous brocades, a gathering of the nobility was awe inspiring indeed.

Commoners wore clothing of similar cut, but avoided both brocades and color combinations that directly mimicked an aristocrat's heraldry. However, Members of Parliament were encouraged to allude to the district they represented in the colors they elected to wear.

On the few occasions in his pre-Elizabeth life where a uniform would not serve, Justin had opted for rather generic colors. Since his official engagement, however, he wore a combination of Gryphon's bronze and dark brown with bands in the Winton colors at his cuffs. Idly, he thought that before he dismissed his valet, he had better make certain his clothing was ready for tonight. (WH2: Queen's Gambit)

Honor felt herself chuckling evilly as she pictured the effect of Elizabeth's gown on those members of the Star Kingdom's social elite who had lifted their noses at her own failure to don the trousers, tail coat, and ruffled shirt of traditional Manticoran court dress on her visits to Mount Royal. She hadn't refused to wear it because she had any problem with the way it looked. Indeed, its elegantly severe lines would have suited her tall, slim figure far better than it did such plump unfortunates as Earl Sydon or poor Lady Zidaru. (AoV)

Elizabeth had attended in Manticoran court dress, the first time in history that a woman had appeared in the sacred precincts of Steadholder's Hall in trousers. (AoV)

Hamish was in civilian court dress trimmed in the maroon and green of the earls of White Haven, as befitted the civilian head of the Admiralty on his way to a formal meeting with his monarch... (AAC)

She wore the elegantly tailored trousers and jacket of formal Manticoran court dress, and the crowd of Spindalians and off-planet diplomats stepped aside to let her pass. (SoS)

The cathedral was like an immense jewelry box, packed with aristocrats in the formal court dress and colors of their houses and commoners whose sartorial splendor and jewelry tended to put the understated elegance of court dress in the shade. (ART)

With that task out of the way, she'd disappeared with Rivka long enough to help her change out of her wedding gown and into the equally expensive (and equally simple yet elegant) formal court dress badged in Winton blue and silver to which she was now entitled. (ART)

Enjoy!


And there you have it, folks.

I do wonder, though, if Honor's and Elizabeth's sartorial influence will make Honor's simplified Grayson-style skirts an acceptable alternative to trousers and tails? (My interest has nothing at all to do with my burning desire to see Dame Estelle in skirts. Nothing, I say!)

I'd also be quite curious to hear the various color combinations. Khumalo, as a serving officer, of course, would be in dress uniform - but what colors does Lady Estelle wear? What about Sonja, if she ever drags herself up from the underworld of technological innovation? What would Khumalo's colors be if he weren't in uniform?

And what does Havenite formal dress look like? (More to my interest, what does Eloise look like in it? :mrgreen: )

I need to know for HonorCon purposes!! 8-)
~*~


I serve at the pleasure of President Pritchart.

Javier & Eloise
"You'll remember me when the west wind moves upon the fields of barley..."
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Re: Court dress in the Kingdom of Manticore -request for dat
Post by Weird Harold   » Thu Jul 31, 2014 8:34 pm

Weird Harold
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roseandheather wrote:I do wonder, though, if Honor's and Elizabeth's sartorial influence will make Honor's simplified Grayson-style skirts an acceptable alternative to trousers and tails? (My interest has nothing at all to do with my burning desire to see Dame Estelle in skirts. Nothing, I say!)


It's possible that Grayson's uniform options for women will have an effect on Formal Fashion throughout the Manticoran Alliance or Grand Alliance.

I think there is far more scope for fashion designers in formal gowns than there is in women's (formal) suits (skirt and jacket type suits) I would expect to see more formal dresses as an option rather than a modification of "court dress."
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Answers! I got lots of answers!

(Now if I could just find the right questions.)
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Re: Court dress in the Kingdom of Manticore -request for dat
Post by Festival   » Fri Aug 01, 2014 12:36 am

Festival
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roseandheather wrote:And what does Havenite formal dress look like? (More to my interest, what does Eloise look like in it?


With the generous helping of French heritage in their background, I'm betting Haven fashion in general is stylin'! My personal preference leans more toward Milan than Paris, but the French do know how to dress. I could see how a lot of their approach to formalwear might have taken route in Nouveau Paris. I could also see a return to a certain sense of elegance following the restoration of the Republic (ending a period of comparatively austere fashion), too.

Eloise in Neo-Parisian coture? As a great Japanese-American philosopher has been known to say, "Oh, myyyyy!"
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Re: Court dress in the Kingdom of Manticore -request for dat
Post by munroburton   » Fri Aug 01, 2014 8:20 am

munroburton
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Festival wrote:
roseandheather wrote:And what does Havenite formal dress look like? (More to my interest, what does Eloise look like in it?


With the generous helping of French heritage in their background, I'm betting Haven fashion in general is stylin'! My personal preference leans more toward Milan than Paris, but the French do know how to dress. I could see how a lot of their approach to formalwear might have taken route in Nouveau Paris. I could also see a return to a certain sense of elegance following the restoration of the Republic (ending a period of comparatively austere fashion), too.

Eloise in Neo-Parisian coture? As a great Japanese-American philosopher has been known to say, "Oh, myyyyy!"


I recall a description of Dolist fashion - gaudy and garish, basically. I don't remember which book it was, but Theisman was reminiscing about his mother - the single photo of her in his possession.

Fashion isn't something I'm terribly interested in, but even I know there are several sets circulating within any given society, so... the austere fashions may only have applied to the relatively narrow window when the Committee of Public Safety was in force and even then, only to the new ruling class, especially if the Legislaturalists were inclined towards extravagance.
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Re: Court dress in the Kingdom of Manticore -request for dat
Post by roseandheather   » Fri Aug 01, 2014 2:10 pm

roseandheather
Admiral

Posts: 2056
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Location: Republic of Haven

munroburton wrote:
Festival wrote:
With the generous helping of French heritage in their background, I'm betting Haven fashion in general is stylin'! My personal preference leans more toward Milan than Paris, but the French do know how to dress. I could see how a lot of their approach to formalwear might have taken route in Nouveau Paris. I could also see a return to a certain sense of elegance following the restoration of the Republic (ending a period of comparatively austere fashion), too.

Eloise in Neo-Parisian coture? As a great Japanese-American philosopher has been known to say, "Oh, myyyyy!"


I recall a description of Dolist fashion - gaudy and garish, basically. I don't remember which book it was, but Theisman was reminiscing about his mother - the single photo of her in his possession.

Fashion isn't something I'm terribly interested in, but even I know there are several sets circulating within any given society, so... the austere fashions may only have applied to the relatively narrow window when the Committee of Public Safety was in force and even then, only to the new ruling class, especially if the Legislaturalists were inclined towards extravagance.


I remember hearing that Dolist fashions were quite extravagant, even garish, but I wouldn't be surprised if the Republic's new leadership were bringing something a bit sleeker and more classic into fashion. Not austere, per se, but maybe something akin to the way women's fashion blossomed in the fifties after the austerity of WWII - something soft but with clean lines. More Valentino than Norman Hartnell, but with that clean, elegant silhouette and full (but not overly full) skirts, or classically cut slacks and less frilly tops for those who aren't inclined toward skirts.

Not that this has anything to do with me wanting to see Eloise in a Valentino-esque formal gown or anything... :mrgreen:
~*~


I serve at the pleasure of President Pritchart.

Javier & Eloise
"You'll remember me when the west wind moves upon the fields of barley..."
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Re: Court dress in the Kingdom of Manticore -request for dat
Post by Michael Riddell   » Fri Aug 01, 2014 3:31 pm

Michael Riddell
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roseandheather wrote:I recall a description of Dolist fashion - gaudy and garish, basically. I don't remember which book it was, but Theisman was reminiscing about his mother - the single photo of her in his possession.


I think that scene took place in "In Enemy Hands", IIRC. :geek:

Being British, the term "Chav" automatically popped into my head when I read it! The "culture" is a perfect fit for Havenite Dolists, in my humble opinion. :lol:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chav

Mike.
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Gonnae no DAE that!

Why?

Just gonnae NO!
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