Topic Actions

Topic Search

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot], cthia, Eyal, George J. Smith and 8 guests

Honorverse ramblings and musings

Join us in talking discussing all things Honor, including (but not limited to) tactics, favorite characters, and book discussions.
Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by quite possibly a cat   » Fri Feb 09, 2018 4:24 pm

quite possibly a cat
Captain (Junior Grade)

Posts: 328
Joined: Tue Sep 19, 2017 6:51 am

Brigade XO wrote:Assuming that O'Hanrahan goes get an interview with Mike (and there would be a treecat present- at this point it is the one bonded to the Marine Srgt) I have to ask:

What possible background detail like WHY the Yawata Strike happened and who did it?
If she KNOWS- rather than some line like " Manticore claims that some previouisly unknown galaxy wide conspiracy perpetrated the strike" then there is a serious problem there for Hanrahan. Try getting out of that room....I doubt Mike is going to do a LIVE INTERVIEW.

How could she "know" who the persons would have done the Yawata Strike are- unless she is somehow either party to it or has critical information that should realisticly be shared with every known star system to guard against this happening again?
Why would she know who was behind the Yawata strike? As far as I can tell she's pretty much exactly her cover story. An investigative reporter. The only differences from a vanilla reporter are genetic mods and a really good tipster. She probably knows she's from a loose cell-like network of people who are trying to make the world a better place, and they've had to hide due to the anti-genie racism that Beowulf and others in the Solarian League used to espouse.
Top
Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by Brigade XO   » Fri Feb 09, 2018 4:33 pm

Brigade XO
Admiral

Posts: 2188
Joined: Sat Nov 14, 2009 11:31 am
Location: KY

Some of the RF governments are openly opposed to Genetic Slavery.
That the leaders of the rest of them (or even those who are leaders of the ones who are opposed) do actualy agree with or like GS is not a given.

Amoung other things, Genetic Slavery has been a cover for Alignment operations perpetrated by "Manpower".
A true beilver in the Alignment probably has a vastly diferent view of the Slaves than the rest of the universe. Note what is going on with Darius. The majorty of the population is NOT Alignmente Star Lines or even some level of Lines just below Star. What they are is essentilay part of an intricate cast system of manufactured humans.....NOT SLAVES...."Never" Slaves. They are NOT Star Line and are more like intelligent worker bees.

So, if the Alignment leadership people of the variouis RF systems are brought up with the same view and ethics (of the Alignment) they can honestly deny support or belief in Genetic Slavery. What they do believe is that they are the genetic superiors of most of humanity which is, at best, usefull tools to be employed and discarded at need. Worker bees. Worker ants.
The vastness of the Manpower operations included experimental breeding and genetic manipulation- quite consistent with the Detweiler/Alignment goals- in thier search for the improvement of humanity and raising up of the Star Lines to be the leaders and oversee everything. They allowed their creature- Manpower- and all those corrupt and morally bankrupt individuals who worked there, to mass produce and sell off various sucessful variations of many experiments lines to cover costs of the real experiments and bury them in the volume and overlapping business structures so created.
They were not "slaves" to the Alignment, they were just various products of the labs that fall below the Alignment's criteria to be Alignment Star Lines and test subjects for manipulations which might or might not be of use to introduce into Star Lines in the future.

There is Alignment and there is not/less than Alignment. Less than is esentialy for work and consumption.

A lot of that kind of reasoning and arguments was thrown around in the defence of Slavey and a number of other systems. Still is for that matter.
Top
Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by cthia   » Fri Feb 09, 2018 6:04 pm

cthia
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 10700
Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2014 12:10 pm

quite possibly a cat wrote:O'Hanrahan is not a telepath. Try to sing at her would not effect her.

Unless she IS a telepath, but even the strongest human psychics we've seen haven't been able to hear a memory song without a) a memory singer and b) a bunch of Treecats on the assist.

Even if she was as powerful as a Treecat she couldn't get the full picture unless it was from a memory singer so an attack like that would do little more than anger her at the half-assed mind control attempt and tip her off (and by extension Darius) to her true potential.

Unless you meant the Treecat would be driven in a rage to attack her, which seems unlikely. Firebrand knew far more, and was deeper inside the Onion than O'hanrahan. She probably doesn't even know that the Yawata strike was from the Malign. Furthermore, a Treecat isn't a mind reader. Said Treecat would not know of her involvement.

Even if the Treecat attacked the best possible outcome is Manticore murders a reporter who was investigating their complicity in the attacks on Mesa. Congragulations! For all intents and purposes Manticore has confessed to everything. Very few people will mourn them when Darius's stealth ships burn their worlds.

What I suspect is far more likely, is that O'hanrahan explains her findings and a little bit about human society to the misinformed Treecats. Notably she can explain about the (potential) Manticorian involvement in terrorist attacks, the proper response to terrorist attacks. In particular she can explain how the Yawata strikes mirror Manticore's attack on Monica. She can explain that the strikes were clearly targeted at military targets only; had they been aimed at planets the devastation would have been vastly greater. Finally, she can explain the human capacity for self-deception and how humans can trick themselves when it is convenient for them. They alter their memories to make things more favorable to themselves. She can end it by asking why haven't they already been told these truths?


You misunderstand me. I am not talking about singing to O'Hanrahan. That's not how it works anyways. I'm referencing the one particular song (ditty) that is ever stuck on treecats' minds. Surely you've had a song or ditty stuck in your head for days.

My niece rang me up and said "Darn you uncle, now that I've read it I can't get your ...

Bim Bam BOOM! VOILA WALLA BANG BANG! BONDED!

out of my head! Arrrgh!"

"Misery loves company, honey."

Multiply that sentiment by a factor of a thousand for the 'Cats.

Then, all of a sudden, O'Hanrahan is in striking distance.

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
Top
Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by kzt   » Fri Feb 09, 2018 7:09 pm

kzt
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 9679
Joined: Sun Jan 10, 2010 7:18 pm
Location: Albuquerque, NM

Of course she knows. It’s vengeance for green pines. :)
Top
Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by cthia   » Sat Feb 10, 2018 1:30 am

cthia
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 10700
Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2014 12:10 pm

kzt wrote:Of course she knows. It’s vengeance for green pines. :)


Bim Bam BOOM! VOILA WALLA BANG BANG! BEHEADED!

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
Top
Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by George J. Smith   » Sat Feb 10, 2018 6:02 am

George J. Smith
Commodore

Posts: 776
Joined: Tue Feb 19, 2013 6:48 am
Location: Ross-on-Wye UK

Brigade XO wrote:Some of the RF governments are openly opposed to Genetic Slavery.
That the leaders of the rest of them (or even those who are leaders of the ones who are opposed) do actualy agree with or like GS is not a given.

Amoung other things, Genetic Slavery has been a cover for Alignment operations perpetrated by "Manpower".
A true beilver in the Alignment probably has a vastly diferent view of the Slaves than the rest of the universe. Note what is going on with Darius. The majorty of the population is NOT Alignmente Star Lines or even some level of Lines just below Star. What they are is essentilay part of an intricate cast system of manufactured humans.....NOT SLAVES...."Never" Slaves. They are NOT Star Line and are more like intelligent worker bees.

So, if the Alignment leadership people of the variouis RF systems are brought up with the same view and ethics (of the Alignment) they can honestly deny support or belief in Genetic Slavery. What they do believe is that they are the genetic superiors of most of humanity which is, at best, usefull tools to be employed and discarded at need. Worker bees. Worker ants.
The vastness of the Manpower operations included experimental breeding and genetic manipulation- quite consistent with the Detweiler/Alignment goals- in thier search for the improvement of humanity and raising up of the Star Lines to be the leaders and oversee everything. They allowed their creature- Manpower- and all those corrupt and morally bankrupt individuals who worked there, to mass produce and sell off various sucessful variations of many experiments lines to cover costs of the real experiments and bury them in the volume and overlapping business structures so created.
They were not "slaves" to the Alignment, they were just various products of the labs that fall below the Alignment's criteria to be Alignment Star Lines and test subjects for manipulations which might or might not be of use to introduce into Star Lines in the future.

There is Alignment and there is not/less than Alignment. Less than is esentialy for work and consumption.

A lot of that kind of reasoning and arguments was thrown around in the defence of Slavey and a number of other systems. Still is for that matter.


And the question to ask them under interrogation with a 'cat in attendance is, "Do you believe yourself to be genetically superior to most of humanity", if they answer no but the 'cat perceives that they are lying then further interrogation is warranted.
.
T&R
GJS

A man should live forever, or die in the attempt
Spider Robinson Callahan's Crosstime Saloon (1977) A voice is heard in Ramah
Top
Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by cthia   » Sat Feb 10, 2018 9:35 am

cthia
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 10700
Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2014 12:10 pm

George J. Smith wrote:
Brigade XO wrote:Some of the RF governments are openly opposed to Genetic Slavery.
That the leaders of the rest of them (or even those who are leaders of the ones who are opposed) do actualy agree with or like GS is not a given.

Amoung other things, Genetic Slavery has been a cover for Alignment operations perpetrated by "Manpower".
A true beilver in the Alignment probably has a vastly diferent view of the Slaves than the rest of the universe. Note what is going on with Darius. The majorty of the population is NOT Alignmente Star Lines or even some level of Lines just below Star. What they are is essentilay part of an intricate cast system of manufactured humans.....NOT SLAVES...."Never" Slaves. They are NOT Star Line and are more like intelligent worker bees.

So, if the Alignment leadership people of the variouis RF systems are brought up with the same view and ethics (of the Alignment) they can honestly deny support or belief in Genetic Slavery. What they do believe is that they are the genetic superiors of most of humanity which is, at best, usefull tools to be employed and discarded at need. Worker bees. Worker ants.
The vastness of the Manpower operations included experimental breeding and genetic manipulation- quite consistent with the Detweiler/Alignment goals- in thier search for the improvement of humanity and raising up of the Star Lines to be the leaders and oversee everything. They allowed their creature- Manpower- and all those corrupt and morally bankrupt individuals who worked there, to mass produce and sell off various sucessful variations of many experiments lines to cover costs of the real experiments and bury them in the volume and overlapping business structures so created.
They were not "slaves" to the Alignment, they were just various products of the labs that fall below the Alignment's criteria to be Alignment Star Lines and test subjects for manipulations which might or might not be of use to introduce into Star Lines in the future.

There is Alignment and there is not/less than Alignment. Less than is esentialy for work and consumption.

A lot of that kind of reasoning and arguments was thrown around in the defence of Slavey and a number of other systems. Still is for that matter.


And the question to ask them under interrogation with a 'cat in attendance is, "Do you believe yourself to be genetically superior to most of humanity", if they answer no but the 'cat perceives that they are lying then further interrogation is warranted.


Bravo! I like that question!

Any reader would have to admit that there most likely exists less than five questions that will flesh out Mesan complicity, independent of whether ONI will eventually discover them.

Watching the boob tube, I've learned that there are several methods that criminals use to actually beat lie detectors. One is by applying pain to the senses (biting the tongue) when the baseline questions of truth are asked, then biting the tongue again during each question in which you will lie.

The resulting spike in pain during the baseline questions which include things like "What's your name?" Will produce the same spike from the pain when you lie.

Pain is an emotion. I wonder if the method can be used to confuse the cat's sensitivity, lost in the midst of pain?

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
Top
Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by cthia   » Sat Feb 10, 2018 1:09 pm

cthia
Fleet Admiral

Posts: 10700
Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2014 12:10 pm

EWSFLASH!!!!!!!! NEWSFL
Recue of Sir Lyman Carmichael and the entire delegation.



GAPING HOLE
LEFT
ON EARTH!



Persons of Interest:
  • Anton Zilwicki. Victor Cachat. Jeremy X. Thandi Palane.


"That's my father!" Says Helen Zilwicki.


Any collateral damage incurred by the League in such an operation would be offsetting because of their criminal complicity in failing to uphold the Deneb Accords.

Son, your mother says I have to hang you. Personally I don't think this is a capital offense. But if I don't hang you, she's gonna hang me and frankly, I'm not the one in trouble. —cthia's father. Incident in ? Axiom of Common Sense
Top
Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by ldwechsler   » Sat Feb 10, 2018 3:28 pm

ldwechsler
Rear Admiral

Posts: 1153
Joined: Sun May 28, 2017 11:15 am

cthia wrote:
Brigade XO wrote:Some of the RF governments are openly opposed to Genetic Slavery.
That the leaders of the rest of them (or even those who are leaders of the ones who are opposed) do actualy agree with or like GS is not a given.

Amoung other things, Genetic Slavery has been a cover for Alignment operations perpetrated by "Manpower".
A true beilver in the Alignment probably has a vastly diferent view of the Slaves than the rest of the universe. Note what is going on with Darius. The majorty of the population is NOT Alignmente Star Lines or even some level of Lines just below Star. What they are is essentilay part of an intricate cast system of manufactured humans.....NOT SLAVES...."Never" Slaves. They are NOT Star Line and are more like intelligent worker bees.

So, if the Alignment leadership people of the variouis RF systems are brought up with the same view and ethics (of the Alignment) they can honestly deny support or belief in Genetic Slavery. What they do believe is that they are the genetic superiors of most of humanity which is, at best, usefull tools to be employed and discarded at need. Worker bees. Worker ants.
The vastness of the Manpower operations included experimental breeding and genetic manipulation- quite consistent with the Detweiler/Alignment goals- in thier search for the improvement of humanity and raising up of the Star Lines to be the leaders and oversee everything. They allowed their creature- Manpower- and all those corrupt and morally bankrupt individuals who worked there, to mass produce and sell off various sucessful variations of many experiments lines to cover costs of the real experiments and bury them in the volume and overlapping business structures so created.
They were not "slaves" to the Alignment, they were just various products of the labs that fall below the Alignment's criteria to be Alignment Star Lines and test subjects for manipulations which might or might not be of use to introduce into Star Lines in the future.

There is Alignment and there is not/less than Alignment. Less than is esentialy for work and consumption.

A lot of that kind of reasoning and arguments was thrown around in the defence o

And the question to ask them under interrogation with a 'cat in attendance is, "Do you believe yourself to be genetically superior to most of humanity", if they answer no but the 'cat perceives that they are lying then further interrogation is warranted.


Bravo! I like that question!

Any reader would have to admit that there most likely exists less than five questions that will flesh out Mesan complicity, independent of whether ONI will eventually discover them.

Watching the boob tube, I've learned that there are several methods that criminals use to actually beat lie detectors. One is by applying pain to the senses (biting the tongue) when the baseline questions of truth are asked, then biting the tongue again during each question in which you will lie.

The resulting spike in pain during the baseline questions which include things like "What's your name?" Will produce the same spike from the pain when you lie.

Pain is an emotion. I wonder if the method can be used to confuse the cat's sensitivity, lost in the midst of pain?


Actually, the question is not all that brilliant. A lot of very bright people think they're smarter than most others. Certainly a lot of movie stars wrongly believe bathrooms smell like roses after they do their business.

A better question would be: Are you part of a group working towards making major genetic changes to the human genome? If you have Anton there, it might be pointed as "Have you been working with the Detweiler's organization?

Also, "What were your orders about covering what has been going on on Mesa?" I realize that is not a yes/no question but treecats would when she starts moving from the truth.
Top
Re: Honorverse ramblings and musings
Post by CmdrAthenaAprilist   » Sat Feb 10, 2018 5:56 pm

CmdrAthenaAprilist
Lieutenant (Junior Grade)

Posts: 41
Joined: Tue Oct 03, 2017 10:53 am
Location: Lacey, WA

cthia wrote:EWSFLASH!!!!!!!!


Right now I'm picturing naked sheep...
Top

Return to Honorverse